It’s truly amazing that pronatalistic prejudice has so greatly and completely infiltrated our society thru our media. News celebrates multiple births (more like litters), peanut butter is sold only to “choosy Moms”, car commercials are sure to show families including children, even suppositories that are taken by adults somehow make the children happier. If you don’t have children, you don’t exist. I think this sucks! What does anyone else think?
Thanks Maida. I read that piece and found it interesting how people worry about getting older and not having children to care for them. That’s a myth. Visit any nursing home and you’ll see how many children are visiting their parents. Not just because they don’t care! Some live too far away! Some are too busy in their careers or their own children’s lives. Saving, investing and planning for your own financial future should be a priority. I also treasure my friendships with my women friends and daughter,son/friends and show people how much knowing and connecting to them is valued. I think about my husband who has two grown daughters who’ve discarded him. There are no guarantees.
This is so true. I once told a co-worker I thought I might need to have a kid so someone would be there to take care of me. Although I was joking, she quickly said that would be no guarantee. She lost a child very young and the surviving child was an addict she cared for. There are no guarantees. If you don’t have children, you’ll have more money to save to care for yourself in old age.
I chose to have children and I am glad I did, but I thoroughly believe it is a choice that is an individual matter and involves no one but the individual and their partner. I have three children and only one chose to become a parent.
My life does not hang on someone elses choices. We should each live our lives for ourselves to the best of our abilitly and we will go a long way in creating a world of peace for all.
I think it’s wonderful that you have expressed who you are, your feelings and what has worked in life, specifically for you! The very best to you on the completion of your new book!
Marcia
Thanks. Sorry I just read this! I would have caught the spelling error but that’s not important. You can take notes and always feel free to ask me anything.
Thanks for standing up for the childless, Marcia! I have so many people have children without considering all the implications, only to find themselves in over their heads. I am a proud aunt and see the joys children can bring, however I’ve seen how the children can suffer when parents are not prepared. Children deserve parents who are ready to nurture them. And we owe it to ourselves not to enter into parenthood lightly.
I do not believe any person is sufficiently prepared to be a parent. I think the only ways a person can prepare is to be financially ready for a child and to be ready to love and support any person selflessly.
You hear parents giving other persons or other parents advice about how they raised their child(ren) and they act as if that is the only way. However, I believe parenting involves adapting. There is a saying every person is different; every baby is different and the growing process for every child is different. There are many factors to consider, but a person can only prepare themselves by being ready to conquer every challenge that may come with being a parent and parenting.
I agree. There’s another way to prepare and that’s to honestly ask yourself if you want the career of parenting. In this society, and indeed others worldwide…. it’s a hard thing to ponder because parenting is bathed in so many unrealistic myths.
What is wrong with a country that requires you to study, pass and exam, get a license before your can drive a car… A country that you have to get a license for your pet, put some serious effort into adopting a shelter animal and adopting a child — but you can freely get pregnant have a child with out any preparation or requirements to keep it? hmmm… If you don’t want it after you get it you can put it up for adoption or sale or just drop it off at a police station… and this is after the pre-natal care and hospitalization was already picked up by medicaid. hmmmm
This is the first comment on my blog I’ve seen in a long time that I LOVE! Let’s add another question: “What’s wrong with a country where you HAVE to be licensed to teach, become a doctor or attorney drive a bus yet never asked to pass anything about becoming a prospective parent?” Thanks so much for this. I am still trying to get ONE agent or publisher interested in my memoir. I keep seeing rejections with: “No big deal today! Anyone can still not have kids and it’s perfectly OK!” Until the childfree lifestyle is given as much acceptance to parenting, more and more will want the societal acceptance of having or raising children.
I have two children from a previous marriage. Parenting doesn’t always follow the “Grand Plan”. They grew up to be educated, professional women. We had a special relationship until I divorced their mother. Since then, the relationship has stopped and they are no longer a part of my life. I have not been invited to any wedding. I have grandchildren that I don’t know and, that don’t know me.
There are no guarantees that your children will value what you do (or sacrifice) for them or, stay in your life. When you choose to have children, don’t assume it all works out “happily ever after.” Many people choose to have children believing their children will always be there for them, just as they were there for them. Yet, when you go to assisted living facilities, many parents spend their last years alone. Sometimes, reality bites!
In my opinion, there’s nothing worse than being discarded after doing the best you could do as a parent. Concentrate on the good you know you did for them. Remember those freeze-framed moments when they gave you happiness or you embraced and enjoyed your role as their loving, committed father. They are independant women, on their own, with decent careers and education. You can’t rationalize with angry people unwilling to honor the love you gave or who refuse to go for help to eliminate that anger.
I do not believe the choice of having children should be based on the expectation that in return your children are to take care of you because you’re their parent. I believe having children, being a parent and parenting should be a selfless act.
My husband and I were recently married. We’ve been together for almost 10 years. We hope to have children soon, but we want to have children as a symbol of our love to each other as well as we want to give our love to another human being who we can encourage and support as well as educate them the best we can from what we’ve learned through our years in all of our different roles: as a child, as a brother, as a sister, as a student, etc.
Parents can only hope that if they give their child(ren) the right teachings and all of their love and support that the child(ren) will return the love when parents need it most, but if they do not, it does not represent a failure in the parenting or that the child(ren) are terrible person(s). I believe parents can only do their best in raising their child(ren) and a lot of what happens in the future is out of their control.
Thanks for this post. I agree that no expectations should be the rule if you choose to parent. Actually, the “no expectations” helps in all of life, doesn’t it? Unfortunately, too many people are bathed in the myth that children will love them forever.
There’s one thing you wrote which I want to comment on: having a child as an expression of your love for each other. A child doesn’t do that. That’s part of the myth. How you continue to treat each other day after day is a better way of expressing that beautiful goal. In my opinion, the only reason for having a child is because you love the career’s requirement, feel you are parent material and have the money.
I have two kids and love being a mom. Sometimes its hard. I have my days where I just want to scream and run because they drive me crazy! But, then when they tell me they love me it just melts my heart. Being a mom is not for everyone. I know people that dont want to have kids like my cousin. Her parents are very uspet with her. They feel that there is something wrong with her who would not want to have kids!! I tell the parents get off her back! Leave her alone! This is her choice. I feel like motherhood is not for everyone just like marrage is not for everyone. I give a lot of credit to people that speak up for themself and what they believe is a good life for them. Just because I like something doesn’t mean someone else has to like that also.
I know a woman that I have been very close to for the last 4 years. Her husband just died. Her kids put her in to a nursing home and they dont really visit her. Ii go there to see her 2x a week with my kids.It breaks my heart that she had 4 kids and she took care of them when they were sick. She loved them, provided for them; now those kids cant take care of one mother! I think its very sad she is not my family member.I love her. She’s been good to my kids and me. I cant even imagine if i didnt go there to see her. Ii just dont know how her kids sleep at night.
I have three children and five step-children from two other marriages. What a joy it’s been to have them in my life…yes….there were sacrifices and sometimes I wanted to run away, especially when five of them lived with me. But I am a very lucky woman: each of these wonderful beings have become my adult friends, and I am so lucky to be part of their lives. For me, the choice was simple at the time I made it…but every person has the right to make their own choices. I am also glad that my children made the decision to have children…selfishly, I have 13 grandchildren to spoil and to love. More importantly, I have the opportunity to see what great parenting skills my kids have, and to witness the strong relationships they have developed with their own children. Having children was the right decision for me…but it’s not right for everyone.
Those of us who choose not to parent are truly happy for you and those who feel made the right choice. It’s all about choices… and the consequences. Do you or anyone out there feel you are prepared for those consequences whether it’s to parent or not to parent? If your children had not had children…. by choice, how would you have felt?
Is anyone out there who has grandchildren and are DISAPPOINTED in them? Please tell us about that.
Realistically, not every couple is designed nor qualified to be nurturing and competent parents. But how will the members of the qualifying committee be chosen??? Until then, anything goes. Hopefully each person will decide if this lifetime engagement is right for a lifelong journey.
Of course, there must be freedoms to choose about whether parenting is a career you want. However, in my opinion, it’s one of the most important careers of a lifetime. Do you, or anyone, feel people are getting educated to question whether or not this career is for them? Do you think the schools are doing their job? I will open another discussion about this on the POSTS.
Very interesting topic and very timely; there is an increasing number of women that cant get pregnant . Although I have kids and I cant imagine my life without them I can understand women that decide to go childless; it is a personal choice and this country is all about personal choices.
Infertility is an agonizing challenge. I’ve heard from so many men and women struggling with it’s emotional and physical toll. I’ve often spoken to infertile support groups who at first, see me as a threat. However, after I’ve spoken, see a new way to fight. They switch from the sentence of being childless to being “childfree”. This takes them away from being a victim to being more in control of how they live their lives.
I’m thrilled you are happy with your choice to parent.
Please excuse the length of this piece, but the complexity of these ideas precludes brevity. Succinctness is the best I can hope for.
The issue of pro-natalism manifests in each culture in a particularly idiosyncratic way. Regardless, there is the universal drive to maintain the community and those people, who conform, satiate this cultural imperative, while those that choose not to comply with this dictum are looked upon as not supportive of the general welfare. These are not conscious perspectives but reside within the social unconsciousness of people as living beings. When viewed this way, there is no surprise that pressure to have children exists, or that people who do not to have children, whether by choice or circumstance, experience marginalization, . This simply is the way it is. This is not to justify the social judgment but rather to accept the reality of it.
While historically, all cultures have promoted procreation to ensure continuity, the fundamental biological imperative, the peculiar way found in American society, reflects multiplicities that are our own. The materialistic exploitation of this fundamental social imperative is so characteristically American, that this too, should not come as a surprise. Every social value has at some point in our history been used to make money. The commercialism of America is intrinsic, it’s like Mom’s apple pie, as so clearly described by de Tocqueville in 1830. Nothing much has changed since then except its contemporary pervasiveness throughout all levels of our society through the “media”. But it is nothing more than a re-iteration of the underlying social ethos.
What is important now, as reflected in Marcia’s advocacy, which is a departure from traditional perspectives, is that the appreciation of a new degree of social freedom available to us. We can now choose not to have children without having to be isolated from our partners. We can live full lives of our own choosing, in the actualization (don’t really like this term, but it fits) of our individuality, in full existential, sexual and emotion connection, without the anxiety of potential child bearing. The technology of contraception, in a variety of forms, enables new opportunities of being within the social community.
As with any new freedom, it should not be unexpected that it will meet with approbation from the community at large. But the struggle to articulate the new perspective is essential to the growth of this community as it enlarges the total possibilities for not only the members of the dominant social environment, but the potential for all, to aspire to greater prosperity (not just material but more importantly, personal). It brings into consciousness responsibility for one’s actions.
The sense of distress for those making this choice is real, considering the considerable social pressures to have children. For this reason, the articulation of this perspective by Marcia is especially poignant at this time. There are too many children who have to address the issues of inappropriate intentions of their parents, whether of men demonstrating sexual prowess, women seeking love or looking to create objects of love, or succumbing to social pressure, or as in my case, an attempt to keep a failing marriage intact, (lucky me, it worked out fine and I’m glad to be here). Many poor intentions, much suffering, some successes.
Several people have responded in this forum in the context of their experiences as parents and its value, or as non-parents and the consequences, hopefully, of that choice. I have my own experiences as a parent, and grandfather which have been beyond expectation, but they really don’t bear on what I consider the core issue of Marcia’s advocacy of freedom of choice in child bearing and parenting. Being a parent is an opportunity not an obligation. There are an infinity of opportunities in our lives. It is most important that we choose wisely as the consequences, especially when they create new beings who have to live with them, have profound effect for all of us.
A very profound and welcomed post, David.Thanks for taking the time. Can you please go to the question I posed about PARENTING EDUCATION.
I would love to see you comment. Can we “choose wisely” when we are victims of pronatalism or are forced to face myths surrounding those who don’t want to have children?
Here’s what I’ve heard… and still do:”But, aren’t you just selfish? Who will take care of you when you’re old? What if everyone feels the same way?
You asked for it, here it is.
Before addressing the question of preparedness for parenting, it seems necessary to distinguish between parenting, bearing and having children. These are not synonymous terms, but rather reflect quite different sets of actions and intents.
Leaving the first for last; child bearing may be considered as the actions up to, and including, the birthing of a child. It sets the ground for all subsequent events. What we want to consider most important in this discussion is the intent leading this momentous action. Whatever the motivation producing this intent, we should recognize that for most people, this is simply the way of having children and parenting them in a family, whether from emotional injunction or social conformity. However, it must be recognized that for others the intent is different. For some men it is a way of demonstrating virility; for some women it enables their womanhood, a rite of passage; some do it to exploit a welfare system; and some do it out of ignorance.
Let me be personal for a moment to elucidate one scenario in my experience. When I remarried, I already had two children and having had a vasectomy, had no wish to have any more children. However, my wife, who had earlier in her life decided not to have children, via two abortions, decided that now she wanted to have a child. Eventually, at age 40, through the technique of artificial insemination, she did have a baby. While the actual pregnancy and birth (a bit complicated but with a satisfactory outcome) were successful, the subsequent times were extremely stressful. She did tell me later, that she had had no idea of “having” a child and all the demands it made upon her life, rather it was the experience of bearing a child that motivated her. I bring this up to illustrate the ambiguity of intention without a consciousness of consequences.
This brings us to “having” children. For most people I suspect the intent of having children is to create a “connected” family, but let it recognized that for some, having children is the manifestation of wanting to be “normal”, being seen as within the community. The ambiance of family and responsibility of parenting are simply the reward and obligation of conforming. Participation can be quite perfunctory, fulfilling a role in society. This is a situation I have observed in my years of going, on a recurring basis, into peoples homes . It satisfies a social need of “parents”. Remarkably, it is often successful in producing successful children, mostly due to the resilience of the children, reflecting their ability to survive and prosper, regardless of the actual environment. A tribute to the tenacity of life.
Now, parenting. This is another scale of being. Staying in the fractal of being, parenting leaps to another state of complexity with retention of pattern, but with new unique, elaborations, not simple reflections of past experience, but creation of new realities. The opportunity for growth of self through transcendence of self as sole subject through the experience of subject to subject. Parent to child as shared presence. (These are terms I’m employing in a paradigm of “narcissism“, perhaps necessarily to be more fully explicated, to be understood).
My biological children are now 42 years old and 40 years old. Over many years I have struggled to maintain relationship to them. It has been successful. The intent was always clear, through the early years, divorce, remarriage, adulthood. I love these children and they some how sensed it. Even when the situations were conflicted I showed up, sometimes supportive and sometimes critical. They always experienced acceptance. They appreciated that it took some moves of mine to adjust and they adjusted too. This is the lesson I have to give. My son is not going to have children but he knows how to love his lady, giving her space, support and accepting of her love. My daughter, who has taken me into her home, in my own space, is more conventional, with a wonderful man as a partner-husband, son-in-law, two children (my grandchildren, lovely people), two cats, a puppy, gold fish and six chickens. We’ve had our confrontations and survived and prospered. I feel I have been a good parent because my children are good people. This is a great validation of me, my place in being.
Now this takes us to another place, being a parent to a child that is not only not my biological child but one resisted into being. When my second wife decided to have a child, regardless of the intent, I resisted vigorously. Applying the arguments, “I have had children. I don’t want to do it again”. “Yeah, well, you had your chance and now I want mine”, “I’m too old (almost fifty) and so are you (forty); who wants old people as parents with impaired energy”, “I’ll deal with it”. No range for compromise. Well, it happened, Graham was born and I had already made the decision that no child, given the opportunity, should not have a father present. I was a child who never experienced a father (good thing for me, as my father was better not known to my child). Still, the idea that a child should have such an empty compartment in their being was repellent to me. Fortunately, by fathering my first children I was given me the opportunity to realize the father to me. A great teaching and blessing to wholeness. Graham is now twenty two years old, a splendid person, bright, appreciative and loving. The recent thing he did was to have me listed on his Face Book page as his father. How proud can a person be to be acknowledged in this way.
So now we can address the question of parent preparedness. Nothing prepares us for being a parent. Knowing how to change diapers, hold a child, set boundaries, or entertain, can deal with the existential events of parenthood. Only by doing it can it be learned. Schools can’t teach it. It is not a career. It is not an endeavor. It is not a skill. It is an art. It is process, learned as we go along. It is a peculiar fabric of life, not for everyone, but for some, it gives a sensuality to life, a fullness of being. This cannot be transmitted, it must be experienced. I am a person who easily projects fearful experiences to be avoided, but some of life’s challenges require one to leap off of cliffs. Parenting is one of the cliff s in my life. I’m flying.
Hi Marcia…congratulations on your adventure. I’m signing in as 52 year old woman without children. I dont often reflect on not having children. I guess I embrace life and it just didnt happen. I blame infertility and meeting a life guy only at 38 years. I had some sense that I wanted a family including children but when it didnt happen I just didnt look back much.
Lately, I am connecting the dots of my life more, reflecting and I thinking a child would have been nice but I cope by just switching gears and embracing life without them. (sublimation they call this) I think my brother called me around age 38 and put the question to me, are you going to have kids but besides that I didnt feel a lot of pressure to conform. At a high school reunion a few years ago I found it interesting a lot of us women didnt have kids yet work in the health field. Perhaps nursing has given me a sense of caring and what its like to “parent” or take care of others like you as a teacher. I sometimes think it would be good to connect more with children as I get older. I heard about a group in Nova Scotia that has “elders” spending time with 2 year olds for a sense of enjoyment. So I think not having children is something I might do if I had the choice again but then again I’ve really had a great life and no regrets at the moment. Its really all about being engaged /connected to people of all ages and staying that way as we grow old gracefully, with or without children. Dont you think?
Thanks for getting me to stop and reflect on this part of my life. much luv & hugs
Also I enjoyed the other blogs …David Kaplan’s blog was excellent, I got a lot from it..the rewards of parenting, the ambiance of family life..I think I always was terrified of birthing and also didnt see the need to conform much to society and without the right man but still a lifesyle that included travel let time slip by. Thanks Marcia will check it again.
HI MARCIA,
I am also a product of the 50’s and 60’s and choose not to have children. For years people asked me if I could not have children or if it was totally my decision. I would always answer that it was my decision. I was married at that time and my husband also did not want to have any children. I have never regretted not having any although having been a teacher I think I would have been a good mother. My dedication for years has been animal rescue so I guess that is what fulfilled my maternal instincts.
Thanks Lori. So happy to know your choice was right for you. I question the whole topic of “Maternal instincts”.
If it’s so instinctive, why is there so much child abuse?
This is a wonderful website. Wish I had all the resources stated when I was making the decision to remain childfree. My husband and I chose not to have children and have not regretted the decision. We have been able to travel extensively and not have the stress that comes along with raising children. We enjoy spending time with our nieces and nephews and our friend’s children but always are glad to return to our childfree home. Parenthood is not meant for everyone and a person’s choice should always be respected. It seems that choosing a child free life style has become more accepted in recent years. When we were making the decision it was still looked upon as an unusual and sometimes selfish decision. I remember a friend saying that it was not normal not to want to have children. The sting of that comment remains with me to this day.
Thanks for this beautiful and heartfelt post. I, too, wish we had more support when I chose not to have children. I’ve learned that “stings” are possible only if we allow them to hurt us. Let that hurt go or you remain a victim of that comment.That comment you heard about you not being “normal” reflects the ignorance of people. When I lost my career because I was interviewed on “60 Minutes”, that “sting’ took another turn. Nobody should have to suffer that way because of misperceptions and ignorance. Being an “other’ in society is always challenging, isn’t it? Look at the topic of Maternal Instincts. I would love to read your reactions to that.Again, thanks for this post.
In my opinion, if there wasn’t an instinctual need to reproduce, our species would surely die out. Our society, however, has made us question our instincts…which isn’t necessarily bad… thoughts???
I aggree that without our biological inclination for reproduction, our species would die out. Of course! However, my question is more about whether or not we learn or acquire that need to reproduce through our society’s expectations, our how we feel about being accepted as a “normal person”.
I always felt an instinct was something inherently a part of us. If I chose not to reproduce, does that mean I never had that instinct? If a mother drives her kids into the water to kill them, has she lost that instinct?
Ever since my children reached puberty, I had to deal with difficult personality issues with each child. I learned of negative genetic issues in my family. I have always been concerned that some of those negative genetic psychological traits would be passed down to the next generation. My concern is that my grandchildren will inherit some of those challenging traits. They can wreak havoc in the lives of the people they touch.
I think that this blog is full of nonsense. It sounds more like everyone in here defending not having kids really does regret it. Or at least are always wondering “what if”? Why else would a bunch of old people have meetings that support their decision? Childbirth is a choice but this blog is full of people that are either regretful or bitter about their own kids. There wouldn’t be this blog if you were all happy about your decision.
Thanks for your comment Alex. You’re right! The need for this blog would never exist if everyone felt they were respected for a personal choice. Maybe there wouldn’t be this blog if people could accept the choice that not having children is as good and viable a lifestyle as having them? Did you know about many surveys asking parents, “If you had it to do all over again, would you have kids?” (The most famous was by Ann Landers in the 70’s where 70% responded with NO!) The July 2010 issue of New York Magazine featured, “I love my children. I hate my life!” I am happy for anyone who has children and enjoys that role. That’s the point! Kids need parents who are prepared and ready to parent. Too many times, we hear of tragic stories. There are too many children suffering because people choose parenting thinking it was their ticket to acceptance. Have you ever considered there are many unhappy parents who wonder, ” What if I never had them?” The sad fact, is…..it’s too late.(By the way, there are many posts from parents on this blog too.)
I am very happy to be a mom, my biological daughter is a joy, the good and the bad. What I wouldn’t choose for my life, if I could get a “do over” are step children. It’s hard enough to love and like your own sometimes but to deal with kids that aren’t your own, Dear Lord is all I will say.
Best of luck with your book Marcia!
I’m happy you have enjoyed raising your own child. (Even, as you say, during those “bad times”.) Being a step parent is an awesome challenge. We try to be accepted and be their friend. We never want to be that step-monster. Yet, we are there to offer guidance as well. Without any preparation, who can blame us for feeling bewildered in this role? Also, it takes two to have any relationship. When the stepchildren aren’t willing to meet you half way, frustration is bound to be there.If the stepchildren are hearing bad things about you, how do we face that? If the original Mom or dad is deceased, the anger that we’re trying to take their deceased parent’s roles hurts too deeply. I totally understand how you feel, Rose.
Your statement is very important. I have found people who say “Why bother about this topic? It’s “old”. On the contrary, it’s not old. Yes. It’s a more accepted choice. However, the reactions of too many people is to feel this choice is hedonistic, unloving, and as you say….selfish. It’s no more selfish than having children to fit into the norm. Or, having children to feel accepted. Or, having children to use as trophies of success. In the corporate or political world, the family man is still regarding with more admiration than the single or childfree man. The women claiming to have it “all” (meaning family and career) is a woman to aspire to. Thanks for your post, Sarah.
Your talk last night at Panera Bread in Stuart was great. Telling about your choice not to have children on “60 Minutes” was really interesting. It was amazing how that show changed your life, including your career, the threats to you and your dog. It was even more amazing how nothing was directed toward your husband. The open discussion and questions after your talk showed a real need to get this topic out into open discussion, maybe even a talk show. I can’t wait until I can get a copy of your book! How do we get you to speak at other organizations?
I have never, in all the years since I was interviewed on “60 Minutes, ever thought about the fact that my then husband, Warren…..never had anything against him for living a childfree lifestyle. I mean his business flourished. I lost a career as a passionate teacher! His life was never threatened; mine was!
As for having me talk, just email me at mdjd7@yahoo.com and we can arrange a mutually agreeable time. Thanks for asking.
Marcia,
Thank you for championing this subject. I think in our age and time, it’s an important option for woman who want to make educated choices in their life. Not to have children is an important option that is still suffering bad PR, and prejudice. Even though more and more choose not to procreate, many are still facing the concept they are “selfish”.
Sara
I think children are a big responsibility. So many teenagers these days are having children and they aren’t ready to have them. Whereas there are adults that can take care of them but can’t have any of their own. I’m 16, and i’ve encountered at least 4 pregnant teenagers that go/went to my school. Child birth is all about being ready to bring another life into this world, and many people aren’t ready. I, myself, haven’t decided on weather or not i want a child. If i do end up having one, it will probably only be one. It’s a very varied topic, and interesting too.
I am honored to have a 16 year old on my blog. How did you find this website? It would be interesting to know that answer.
Teenagers KNOW that a sperm and an egg can make a baby. Yet, both the boy and the girl don’t take precautions together not to get pregnant! In my opinion, It’s the responsibility of two people having sex.
Childbirth is only the act of bearing a child. It’s a mere second in a lifetime of raising a child. At this stage of your life, I would concentrate on your education. and remember, that “baby” is only a small part of a human’s life. Unlike yourself, many teens see that baby like the dolls they played with when they were little girls. Nobody wants to give birth to a teenager, right? When the time is right, this should be discussed between you and who will be your life partner. Actually, in this day and age, many women are choosing not to partner and raise a child alone. Again, at 16, enjoy your life and plan the future that best suites your needs. Thanks for this post.
My church is offering a series on “Overcoming disappointment with your children”. This topic is real yet no one tells you when you are seeking to be a parent that the day will come (and it will come) that you will not be happy with your childs life choices. Whether the disappointment is small and insignificant or large and life changing, the fact of the matter is, you just aren’t prepared for the hurt. We are made to believe that you have these beautiful bundles of joy and the life you have laid out before them (in your mind) may not be the life that materializes. They may NOT like school, they may NOT get good grades, they may NOT go to college, they may NOT want to get a good job, they may NOT even want to work. They may NOT even want to leave your couch. There are no guarantees that a happy, healthy, beautiful baby turns out to be a happy, beautiful, successful adult. Just like a big, expensive, elaborate (you really can’t afford it) wedding does not get you a successful, till death do us part marriage.
I think the desire to fly in a baby-free zone is talltoy legit and it\’s really not personally about anyone actively disliking any particular child, it\’s about enjoying peace and quiet.I\’ve been on flights with many a crying child, and while it isn\’t a picnic, I try to have sympathy for the parents, who are usually dealing with things the best they can. On only two exceptions have I been really upset at a child\’s behaviour -in both cases, the parents were letting the child entertain themselves by actively kicking and hitting the back of my seat, which was really not pleasant. In one case, I asked the child to stop their behaviour myself, which perhaps was overstepping a parental line, but I got absolutely no response from the parent (at least the kid stopped the kicking). So, parents, as long as your kid isn\’t actively smacking anyone\’s seat while you encourage them, you\’re probably good!
Such a powerful, honest and heart felt post. Those tiny bundles of joy are precious until they say their first “No!”. Or, until their choices don’t meld with your own expectations.You are right;nobody teaches how to adapt to these real experiences because there are no required preparations for the job of parenting.
I wonder what will be “taught” at this series in your Church. Keep me posted if you take it or know of anyone taking it.The trouble is these series or classes are often given after having children are born.Many chose having children to fit their own needs or wants. Or, they will go on trying to change their childrens dreams to fit their own. And, sadly, most will wind up very disappointed.
I really don’t know how I feel about not having children. At 40 years old, I am looking back and regretting many stupid things I did as a young adult and the choices I made regarding having a family, husband, home etc. etc. I am not sure if I can rectify anything I have done or if I really want to. I see my friends having children in their late 30’s and early 40’s and say, maybe I could, but, then I hear children screaming outside, playing on a holiday when I would like peace and quiet and think…”KILL IT”…. (probably not the best thought to have if contemplating family….just sayin!!!) I am happy for all my friends who have embraced parenthood … and when I say parenthood and friends, I mean, men and women friends. Parenting takes two..despite what the books and media have told most. I think in order to have a well rounded child, it takes two parents. I see so many people have children and it kills their relationships, most of my friends are divorced, separated OR…Hate their spouse and resent them. I don’t think this is the kind of life I would like. I have enough trouble on my own in a relationship without the help of a waling child.
I know the adage of having a child so it can take care of you when you are old..but, I think as a child of two aging parents, it is a horrible thing to do to a child.. ask a child to care for me and clean up after me….completely SELFISH and miserable and if this is the reason you are having children, you better hang onto your bootstraps, because, said Slave, er, child, is going to rebel like hell and move about 1500 miles away from you and get conveniently busy when it comes time to schlep home and do your dirty work for you… I see more and more a lot of my friends who are dealing with aging parents or sick parents are becoming completely resentful and lashing out and writing horrible things on our wonderful social networks about how terrible their life is, and how they wish they were not around to take care of their parents and want to place them in a home.. and not in a funny, haha, sort of way, more like in a serious (if I had the money) sort of way…I myself do not think this, nor would I choose this, but then again, I don’t know what could happen in a few years down the road…
Having children is an important decision one must make.. it is not a matter to be taken lightly and in a haphazard manner.
I have read some of the comments here for and against, I don’t know whether I am for or against. Time will tell, I suppose.
It’s absurd that women and men assume they should have children. I chose not to have children. I am not and never have been sorry. It’s a personal decision. Why society pressures couples, particularly women, to breed is beyond me. Children are great, but not for me. I’ll never regret being child free. Many people I’ve spoken with (both men and women) have confessed they never really wanted kids, but succumbed to the pressure. I’ve always tried to live my life using my beliefs, not someone elses….more people should try it.
It warms my heart to hear you are taking on this controversial subject, shining a well needed light on it, in the form of a book. In doing so, you will leave your mark on this world and earn a very special reward for your effort… immortality. You will live on forever in the hearts and minds of those who read your thoughts.
If you want to give a lifetime gift to a friend…. Give An Interesting Book! I am sure yours will be interesting….
Thank-you for your blog. Even in 2011, being childfree is not considered a valid choice. I had a former friend ask this past year if my choosing not to have those babies was due to troubled childhood. Never mind that she was pregnant with her formerly-married lover’s baby and had dramedy going on with her own family! I get so tired of people wanting to think it is solely about my growing-up years.
I never wanted to be a mother since I could remember and before I realised my family was chaotic. Growing up in the 70’s, I saw how many women were discarded from marriage and how it was hard to collect child support back then. The divorced mothers struggled to eke out survival while the fathers were worshiped by my girlhood friends. I saw how the divorced mums also felt they had to accept so little from boyfriends as men with something going for them did not want a woman with extra mouths to feed.
I was never a maternal person and felt motherhood was a leghold trap. Even at a young age, babies and dolls did not interest me. It is not always about childhood, either. I know too many women from my youth who chose to be a mother so they could rewrite history by claiming how they would not do their kids the way they had been done by their parents. Sadly, history did repeat itself.
I am another one who never regretted saying “NO” to children. I got my tubes tied as a younger woman and am thankful every single day how I defied society. I have a decent life now. Had I followed what society and religion wanted, I would be forced to a McJob to feed children and have health coverage for them. The childfree choice should be offered as a viable option to women and men.
It warms my heart to read posts like yours. I’ve been told this is not a topic worth discussing as choice is now wide open. I beg to differ. Although more and more people are making this choice, if they go public, the reactions may not be so supportive. I don’t think they can be fired as I was for announcing my choice on “60 Minutes”. That’s good.
Please share this site with others and have more people tell their stories. I’m also hoping more parents tell the truth about the disappointments they have faced with the reality doesn’t match the promise of parenting.
By the way, in the 70’s many women could not get their tubes tide if their doctors thought they were too young! You were lucky to find a doctor who valued your own needs.
Marcia Drut-Davis
My husband has his own computer business. That’s how.
Trust me…I don’t know anything about designing any blog. (LOL)
Thanks for the vote of confidence.Are you a person who has no regrets about not having raised children?
I cannot agree to using or doing anything that would inhibit a Woman from having a child, but I agree that having a child if the Mother does not want it is a bigger sin. An unwanted child is an unwanted piece of trash and if often hurt or will suffer the life on being unloved and constantly interfering with the good times of its mother. This is usually the result of the mother that was not properly cared for by her mother or father. God Bless those women who do not have children and grant that those that do want a child will have it.
Thanks for taking the time to post your response. Religious people have difficulty with the idea of choice. Indeed, many wedding ceremonies ask the couple to accept children lovingly into their hearts. Right? You don’t agree with people who who have children who are not wanted.Yet, if people can’t use protection, how can choice be viable? In my opinion, I don’t support people having children because they feel they should, or want to be accepted by their family, or want to save a marriage, or want to have someone to love them forever.
I have often thought of having a child, but I have also thought about the negative stigma of being a gay parent in today’s society. Not to say that being a gay parent is a problem, there are so many problems in our culture without adding this to the list. Really who can define what normal or healthy is. Every house is vastly different from one to another. I mean surely I have a great job and the resources to take care of a child, but for some reason to adopt I would have to wait three times as long as a heterosexual woman. I mean correct me if I am wrong but does anyone want to be considered what society today considers “normal”?
Thanks for this honest post, Michael. It’s a harsh reality that gay people would have to wait three times as long to adopt. I don’t think breasts potentially being able to produce milk and a vagina makes for a better “mother”. It would very interesting to know whether or not the same pronatal influences have the same effects on gay people. Are they a better couple if they decide to adopt or have a child born from a surrogacy birth? Are they looked upon with more acceptance if they are seen as a family of more than two?
Ask some of your gay friends. I’m sure that would be an interesting read for anyone reading this blog.
As for whether or not living a normal lifestyle is what people want….you yourself said that very word “normal” so subjective! What’s normal any more? Yet, it is normal, in my opinion, to want and have children by the majority of society’s all over the world .I wonder if I was on “60 Minutes” again is people would still threaten me?
Any human not in the “normal” group faces challenges. So sad, isn’t it? Society has a definition for normal that doesn’t meet reality many times.It’s up to us to be open, honest and embrace our own lives with passion, self respect and acceptance. To not do that is remaining a victim of society’s ignorant branding.
I think so. Yeah. Everyone should be taxed because even if you don’t have kids, there is a societal good to having free education for all kids. The alternative would be to only have education for those who can afford it. We either all chip in for roads, fire departments and schools and libraries or we don’t. We all benefit from these things, even if we never use them. Just my two cents.
Thanks Jen. I agree. But do you think everyone should have the same amount of taxes? Should The Duggers pay the same as you who have
much less (or no) children? Your two cents are important. Thanks!
When I was child free I never balked at paying for the schools. Most districts levy a tax on housing to pay for it. So, only homeowners are taxed to pay for schools in many places. We supplement that with a sales tax. So really, lots of people with kids are paying no taxes towards schools at all and others are paying more. I don’t think it should be tied to number of kids or lack of kids at all. It’s a societal good that the children that exist in our society be provided with a quality education. If you want a good society then you should be willing to help pay for that. It has nothing to do with whether or not you have kids. I’ve never thought so anyway and I’ve always been happy to pay taxes to support schools. Even when I was childless.
Can you please tell me more details in this question? I get so many wonderful responses and just don’t know what you are asking. Please refresh me as to what this is about. Thanks.
I love to teach English as a second language. I see you may speak another language. I want to know what you write.
Can you explain, “Is ready to help?”
This is a sore subject with me… I do NOT believe I should have to pay taxes for schools!! I did not choose to have children, so I don’t think it is necessary to pay, so every brat in the school can have his/her own laptop computer and whatever else they give kids now. I live in one of the countries highest school tax areas, and also one of the largest senior citizen communities in the country. I am not a senior but I do understand how the seniors feel. They are retired, living on a fixed income and they have to pay for other peoples kids to have a billion dollar education. If schools were more like when I went, they would not need so much money.. Somehow, people have gotten clouded judgement about children needing to have a decent education, and yet, I AM SMARTER than said children…I cannot believe how stupid children are these days. I listen to them talk and they sound like blithering idiots…sorry, but, NO I don’t want to pay for your retard to have an education, especially for all those “spectrum disorder” classes…when most parents should stop feeding their children MSG laden crap food and stay at home and cook a meal here and there for their kids so they don’t have ADD and ADHD…Perhaps we could spend less on school if parents actually parented their children and stopped letting an idiot box do it for them.. and now that I am getting off topic I will stop here.
You won’t win anyone with words such as “brats” and “retards”.They are terrible words that will never win you any arguments.
I agree that many kids labeled as ADHD could use better foods and nutritional support but there are no parenting classes to teach this before people have children.
I do feel we should pay taxes for education. That’s how our education was funded , wasn’t it? However, I don’t feel it’s fair if I have none and the person across the street has 5 and we pay the same taxes.
Thank you. Unfortunately, there have not been many replies. people are still not open to my opinion that parenting should be taught before anyone chooses this difficult career. We must be tested to drive a car but not raise a human.
I as a 45 y.o. male strongly feel that it should be a woman’s right to parenting. Whether it be maternal, adoption, invitro or step parenting it is her choice, the given right to her by the Universe.
I wish I knew someone like you when I was growing up.
I knew from childhood that I didn’t want to be a parent. People in my family and even total strangers told me throughout my life that I was cold, defective, that I would be old and alone, that no man would ever want to be with someone who didn’t want children. A high school teacher, after conducting a class session in human development in which we were to write an essay describing how we felt about children and babies, called my mother at home to tell her I was “disturbed” since I had written “I don’t really care for babies. They’re kind of gross and noisy. If someone else wants to have them, that’s fine. It’s just not for me. I don’t even babysit.”
In women-centric offices, even though I was civil to parents, I heard whispers of “Oh, she’s the one who hates kids!” when it wasn’t even warranted. My favorite aunt told me that I “will never know true love.” This didn’t take place in the 50’s…this took place from my childhood in the 70’s all the way up to the 90s and I will sometimes catch a little grief these days, even though I’m beyond an age where child-bearing is considered safe and/or sane. Who knew?
Fortunately, I found my voice in my 30’s and raised hell in the media on behalf of the Childfree Network. I met Elinor Burkett (The Baby Boom author) in 2000 while taping a talk show pilot. I agitated on behalf of equal access to time-off benefits in the workplace, both in the public sphere and even at my own workplace. In person and online, I met many childfree sisters and continue to do so today.
I want to thank you for all of your work in paving the way for us. What you had to deal with in the wake of the 1974 broadcast made my heart hurt when I read about it. Thank you for the work you did then, and the work you are doing now on behalf of childfree people. I hope I can move through life with the grace and dignity that you have. I look forward to your memoir!
You know me now and I’m here for you, delighted to be connected on our life-path. I’ve spent 36 years years waiting to have the courage to write a book from the depths of my heart. All those people who wrongly categorized me, tarred and feathered me , warning of dire regrets are answered in my memoir, “Confessions of a Childless Woman”. Have there been regrets or self doubt? Of course! But when you read the memoir, you’ll see why! I believe you’ll enjoy the honest revelations. Thanks for these marvelous posts. Keep them coming!
Hi Marcia-
Just came across th is blog today; it’s wonderful.
The Duggars just scare me outright. “Pronatalist Nightmare” is an apt description. What scares me the most is how fascinated children are with the Duggars’ show. Instead of the show serving as a jumping-off point for discussion responsible family planning(including the right to NOT reproduce), many families I know of think it’s cute or entertaining.
The show is a postcard for irresponsible family planning, rigid gender roles, and lack of bodily autonomy(Michelle has put herself and unborn kids at risk by having so many, but leaves it up to her god). I was once laid up at home, sick with the flu. I watched a couple of episodes and witnessed the Trainwreck Effect; it was all so appalling that I couldn’t look away. That might explain why others like the show, I don’t know. I think the media embraces this family for the same reason. However, I notice they are getting less publicity in the wake of their youngest daughter’s birth; the little girl was born prematurely, and Michelle was in danger as well. Enough is enough, and I think the brainwashed public finally figured that out.
Welcome Elaine! I am smiling ear to ear this Sunday morning. I love your response. I love how you write and the wisdom in what you share. Maybe you and I can be on a panel discussion in the future? Or, a seminar when I bring my memoir to the public! How did you find me? Where do you live? (I live bear a beach too!)
By the way, did you see the opening previews on “The Duggers” where she’s asked if we will see another little Dugger this year? Her answer was that she would LOVE that! Cry with me.
As my younger classmates would say, “OMG What?!” The thumping you hear is my head hitting the wall just now.
The larger question should be can her body even safely carry another little Dugger? What is with these people?! Furthermore, does she not think about the needs of her existing kids? Life in that house has got to be like life in a group home. We all know how well that turns out.
I think that if child-bearing and child rearing were instinctive, childless women would either be adopting in droves or kidnapping children. No doubt that we are designed to reproduce, but unlike other species, we have the ability to exercise reason over urges and impulses.
As a little kid in the 70’s, I received dual messages: toys and games designed for girls that almost always involved “mommy” role-play, and excellent TV shows such as Mary Tyler Moore, Maude, and the Bob Newhart Show, all shows that had either childfree female lead characters or as in the case of Maude a parenting lead character who got an abortion in the face of an unwanted pregnancy. I loved those shows because even if the storylines, etc. were above my head, they featured women with no kids, and that reassured me that I was not abnormal.
Girls and young women today are bombarded with “Bump Watch” layouts in celebrity magazines, pregnancy reports, gushing testimonials from celebrities about the wonders of parenthood, and not to mention that tired saw of “You can have it all!” Even mothers can’t catch a break, because they get flooded with “Supermom” messages from most media outlets and from their friends. There are few, if any, TV shows with childfree characters, and if there are, they are presented as shallow and materialistic. For those who lack a strong sense of self or those who deny their urge to NOT reproduce out of fear of marginalization, the drive to conform to these messages can indeed feel like instinct. It’s one of those “nature or nuture?” questions to be sure! =)
A friend of mine from several years back admitted to me that while she loved her kids, she would have rather have not had them. She only had them because both her parents and in-laws in her very traditional family intimated she was probably a Lesbian if she didn’t want kids, and that her husband would leave her if she didn’t “give him children.”
Where does instinct leave off and where does relentless, overbearing pressure come in? How many girls and women are going to ignore their true wishes and cave into these ugly pressures at the expense of the kids they didn’t want in the first place?
Urgh. The requesite middle-school parenting class. I remember when my 7th grade class did this, and I wanted to opt out. “How dare this school assume I’m going to be a ‘mommy’ some day. How sexist!” was my line of thinking.
I think the schools need to de-emphasize parenting and concentrate more on explaining family composition, and that families of two are just fine. Inasmuch as I don’t see the schools as the primary agents for parenting education, the focus does need to be on making thoughtful, educated relationship decisions and not just parenting decisions. Educating youth about healthy relationships and sound decision-making goes so much farther than just parenting education.
As for the parenting assignment in my middle school class? The teacher listened to my argument, penalized me for being a non-participant and assigned me an essay instead.I hope kids today fare better.
OK, I’m back. I think I can be coherent.
It’s stuff like this that makes me grateful for gender-neutral toys. As if the current marketing ploys aimed at little girls aren’t bad enough(“Girl’s World” aisles at Toys R Us, Easy-Bake ovens, “Princess” merchandising far beyond the Disney Princesses, et al) they are even more pigeon-holed into the Mommy role more than ever before. Wait. “Imprisoned” in the mommy role is a better choice of words.
I can just hear the breast v. bottle factions loading their weapons, but this isn’t about breast vs. bottle. It’s about relentless, pronatalist marketing. By it’s very design, the doll excludes boys who happen to like dolls, sending the implicit message that doll play isn’t appropriate for boys because males can’t nourish their young.
The media misrepresented itself as a nonbiased entity and then virtually attacked this woman on camera wiping out her livelyhood and basically ending life as she knew it and did it all without even an appology or thought as to what they were doing. This reminds me of the Romans who sent others to fight for their lives for entertainment.
The media manipulates emotions and creates public issues that really are none of anyones business but the individual.
Having children is a choice, not a requirement.
Personally, I think that 60 Minutes owes Marcia Davis more than an appology.
Thanks Linda. Spread the word.
I never even met Mike Wallace who ended that 1974 telecast with, “Pardon our perverseness for showing this on Mother’s Day”.
Hi Marcia – I’m so glad to have come across your blog. I’ve been talking with a PhD candidate from Yale who’s doing research on NON/NAOP and it’s renewed my interest in all things childfree. My husband and I were active national NON/NAOP members. In fact, I was the last president of the organization when we closed the doors in 1982. At that time, due to funding cuts (Reagan administration), we felt we’d gotten the word out and hoped that other organizations would work to carry on the message about choosing to have children. ETR Associates in Scotts Valley, CA is still producing the “Am I Parent Material?” brochure developed in the late 70s.
I have a transcript of the “60 Minutes” program from 1974–so very sorry about how it affected your life. We were very active in St. Louis and the Bay Area and were often misquoted, and misrepresented, but never with such dire consequences.
We’ve just celebrated our 37th anniversary, and the 35th anniversaries of sterilizations–and not once have we regretted our decision.
WOW!!! So wonderful to hear from you. Our stories still need to be heard, don’t they? I believe most people thought I would be a saddened woman as I approached my 70th year on this planet.
NOT!
I also have a copy of that 60 Minute fiasco and would LOVE to have them revisit me. What did I know then?
My memoir is in the hands of an interested literary agency. Been there before so I just keep sending out the query letters.It’s been a long haul and worth it.
I was saddened to hear of Ellen Pecks untimely death from cancer in her early 50’s. She was the pioneer spirit who reached out to me at a time when the word “childfree” was unknown!
Thanks for posting and I look forward to hearing from you again.(Maybe next to me when we are interviewd on “60 Minutes”!)
Write to them and suggest they do that. 60m@cbsnews.com
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I’ve read back issues of the AARPmag, and the editorial slant of it is awfully middle-america/apple pie/vanilla ice cream to me. I think the upcoming generation of those who are of grandparenting age will hopefully be more educated, opinionated, and therefore more likely to discuss some of the realities of grandparenting. The magazine’s current readership is still comprised of those who didn’t have the option of childfreedom, so the magazine is going to preach to the choir…for now, anyway.
I would love to read honest reflections on some of those disappointments grandparents have felt, wouldn’t you? Some of my own personal friends and family have confided their extreme disappointments. Some have taken their grandchildren out of their wills!
Many people told me the biggest regret I would feel is the loss of grandchildren. Probably….if they were caring, warm, deliciously sweet and fun. (And is I could afford it.) There are never any guarantees as those assurances are never promised in raising children.
I have seen many people become uber grandparents where their entire lives revolve around their grandchilden sucking out any other possibility. I guess if that fits their needs, it’s OK. For me, I can’t stand hearing all those endless stories about little Lucy’s accomplishments or the photos of Little Lucy in dance class with the same silly look in every moment of frozen time.
Hi from Denmark!I am a woman born in 1984 and I just got sterilized:-) alcautly I smile like a monkey on dope every time I get to show my scars of, but unfortunately it cannot be shown to every body. only five have seen them. So far.But I am glad I got it done, just not that happy about peoples reactions towards sterilization. My sister has three kids and is undergoing that same surgery I have had in a couple of days, and even though she has kids and runs a daycare, people still seem chocked when she tells about the operation. (She is 37 btw)But any who . Is there a good chance for me to view your apperance on 60 minutes?I would really like to see it and get my boney hands on your book now we are at it;-)Keep speaking up!They can’t ignore us if we just talk louder;-)Sincerly Anne Stenkje6r
Hi Anne! I remember you! You cant stop people from being ignorant. Nor, would I even try to convince people that my choice is right for me! Just keep on keeping on.
I have a copy of that 60 Minute program but I can’t share it. I am asking people to contact 60 minutes and request a revisit to that topic shown in 1974! The book can be purchased at amazon.com.
If you order it, let me know your reactions.
Wonderful seeing you in this blog!
Marcia
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In many cases you are never in a situation that you feel like you can be responsible enough to have kids. In that case, then yes, I am one of them that have a whole bunch of “furry kids”. And now I’m getting too old and still not stable enough to even think about bringing little humans into this world. The pets can take the place … But there is still an empty spot in my heart at times.
Fill that empty space in your heart by volunteering to be a Big Brother or become a mentor. There are so many kids out there who need your loving attention. Thanks for your sweet share.
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Do you think people still face criticism if they say they don’t want to have children?
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I did not want kids – don’t want to even hold other peoples ‘new babies’.
This doesn’t make me a bad person, but when a new mother says to me ‘don’t you want to hold the baby? at a social event or comes to visit. It is a tricky thing to tell this happy new mom, ‘no thank you’. Then, they want to teach you how to do it safely, … “no you don’t understand, I REALLY do not want to hold your baby or anyone’s baby. Please don’t take offense.
I don’t think babies are cute either.
I also hate people thinking how sad it is that I gave up having children for my career as a professional. Why? I graduated with a BS degree and a Master’s in Healthcare Administration, and was a board certified administrator when I retired. It was what I wanted to do. There is nothing ‘wrong’ with me because I didn’t want to be a mommie. Mothering is a full time job – 24/7. You can leave the office at the office, you can’t leave the children and I didn’t want to make that sacrifice for anyone. I lost two wonderful men over it.
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I deeply appreciate this post. I’m working on getting my memoir published! Thanks for this vote of confidence. People still have no idea what pronatalism feels like. Even with choice being more acceptable, it’s still a social stigma not to want children.
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Enjoyed looking at this, very good stuff, thanks . “Be not careless in deeds, nor confused in words, nor rambling in thought.” by Marcus Aurelius Antoninus.
Pardon me, but I tried to email you concerning something on your blog but the given email address did not work. Is there an alternate place I might get a hold of you?
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I am so happy to read this. This is the kind of manual that needs to be given and not the accidental misinformation that’s at the other blogs. Appreciate your sharing this greatest doc.
I am 65 years old and made the decision NOT to have children when I was 25. I was married but my husband and I made the decision together. Good thing; we divorced, I remarried a man who had one child and didn’t want more. WE divorced (he found a younger trade-in) and I vowed never to marry again. Never say never. I married for the third time, a man who had a daughter whom I’ve helped raise. Now she is a mother and I can enjoy HER daughter. I’ve never regretted my decision, I’ve had a lovely career, freedom to pursue adult interests, travel, take graduate courses and enjoy my relationship with my husband. Call me selfish, but I knew as a young adult that I was not prepared or mature enough to be a parent. My parents never bugged me about wanting to have grandchildren and left me to make my own decisions. For that I will be forever grateful.
I couldn’t agree with you more about Scary Mommy. I’m a child psychologist so it goes without saying that I have TONS of parenting books (and believe me, there are a lot out there). However, this is the one book that no mother should go without. It’s the only one that really tells the truth about motherhood. Check out my review if you’d like:
I breathed a sigh of relief to read your post. These blogs attract so many people just out to lure you to their site to sell something! You have given me hope that others can and will read this blog .I will check out the review and share your support of this book. My own book, “Confessions of a Childless Woman” is done. (Honestly, I had that title for three years!) It’s now three years trying to find that literary one agency willing to support the project. I won’t stop until I find them.
There’s another older book I can recommend called “The Mother Person by Barber and Skaggs.
Thanks for this post and supporting my efforts. PS: Have you seen this months AARP magazine about the rise in estranged adult parent/child relationships? Sure breaks the myth that says kids will love and respect you forever.
I think you’re right. We say that woman are free to make a decision not to have children, but in all actuality I’m pretty certain society doesn’t support this decision at all. I think we have a long way to go before our actions match our words.
Delicious to have a real post from a real woman who is helping others. I’m honored.
People always tell me it’s no big deal these days to honestly tell people there’s been a choice not to raise kids. The responses heard may be, “Sure! A lot of friends feel the same way.” Then, they walk away thinking,”Hedonistic, selfish bitch”. Advertising still sells products having nothing to do with children, with babies depicted as a normal way of family life.. (It’s usually an adorable baby and rarely a snarky teenager.) Even with more TV shows showing better reality, it’s with a lot of humor with all the challenges solved within the time constraints of that show.
One of the posts on your own wonderful blog was from a mom being pressured by her son to have a sibling. Even kids want to keep up with the norm!(I answered that post today.)
Thanks for being with me as I continue to swim against the stream. It’s good to have a buddy along the way.
Hi from Denmark!
I am a woman born in 1984 and I just got sterilized:-) actually I smile like a monkey on dope every time I get to show my scars of, but unfortunately it cannot be shown to every body. only five have seen them. So far.
But I am glad I got it done, just not that happy about peoples reactions towards sterilization. My sister has three kids and is undergoing that same surgery I have had in a couple of days, and even though she has kids and runs a daycare, people still seem chocked when she tells about the operation. (She is 37 btw)
But any who…. Is there a good chance for me to view your apperance on 60 minutes?
I would really like to see it and get my boney hands on your book now we are at it;-)
Keep speaking up!
They can’t ignore us if we just talk louder;-)
Anne! How wonderful to hear from you. Denmark? One of my favorite people on this planet, who I call my “daughter-friend” is from Finland.
It’s refreshing to find a real person sharing real feelings with me.(There are so many spam artists who try and sell things via these blogs. )
When I just read your response, I smiled. I reached another person!
You’re choice to be sterilized made me remember many of my women friends in the 70’s who couldn’t get it done! Men had a better chance. Not women! At least that has changed.
The childfree lifestyle is rich and rewarding. There may be times of “regret” but that’s to be expected with so much emphasis on feeling the loss of never being a mother.
In my book, I talk about that in two chapters: Childfree vs. Childless and Menopause.
The book is currently being read by an agency showing interest. It’s the 5th time I’ve had an agency interested. I keep hearing, “it’s no big deal any more not to want kids”. People have no clue how this choice is still viewed with distain. As soon as I know it’s published, I will let you know.
I have one copy of the “60 Minutes” show. They make it difficult to share it threatening me with a hefty fine unless I pay them $300.00.
The last comment from Mike Wallace was, “Pardon our perversion for airing this on Mother’s Day”.
You made my day by writing to me. Thanks so much.
Marcia
“women in their 20’s” does not just mean 20 and 21 year olds. I’m 29 and just had my first child. My boyfriend and I are not married. And I understand fully what it means to have a child and to raise her and to do right by her. I wasn’t lured by Hollywood. I have an ok job and I make decent money to support her. I made a choice. And I don’t need a piece of paper signed by the government to prove myself. I don’t owe an explanation to the world for my decisions. Articles like that do nothing but make me angry.
What is “normal” anyway? And whatever it is, I’m sorry that we can’t all fit into that nice little slot for you. Isn’t this whole blog about how you decided to go against the norm? Then why is it that when someone else does something that you find “weird” or “different” do you have an entire blog post about how it’s wrong?
Julie, thanks for responding. I will go back and read that article. I never want to make anyone angry. That’s not a happy feeling.
The most important thing is to make choices that are right for each of us. I wish you well and hope you continue to enjoy being a parent. I am always in awe of people who do that well while enjoying that career.
I absolutely agree with you that a piece of paper is nothing. Love, commitment and making choices while knowing their consequences is important. Right?
It’s been a while since I saw the article you cited so give me a chance to re-read it?
That article was in response to a NY Times Article in March. I didn’t write it. And, I can see why it would upset you. You made a few good points. Being 29 may be different from 20. Yet, it is in the span of years that NY Times article sited.
I’m curious as to why you checked out this blog. You made a good choice for yourself. Right? You are a happy parent, right? I think that’s terrific! Why did you check out this blog? I will tell you to be careful of people trying to convince you to have a second or third child. It’s pronatalism. Continue to make choices that make you happy. Again, thanks for your comment.
Just self publish – screw the agents! I’m sure you would have enough interest judging by comments and feedback on this blog. You could produce an e-book that wouldn’t cost much. Your posts have been a great read for me today, and I think others like me (considering childfree/on the fence) would very much like to hear your experiences. I’m surprised no agents have picked up on this as a selling point! There must be millions of people my age (34), time ticking, having to decide what path to take. Keep us updated would love to hear more.
These questions are a big help for someone like me who’s on the fence…
“Am I parent material?” – I’m a step parent, have a great relationship with my step child so yes I know I can parent well.
“Do I have money, time etc?” – Money comes and goes, were ok. Plus I think once they come you manage (like my mom did). I do like my own time though..
“Am I having a child because I don’t want to be considered an “other”? Am I having a child to get attention? Am I having a child to get myself away from a boring job or schooling?”
– No. None of the above. I’m secure in my own choices and don’t mind what others think. I definitly don’t want a child for attention! (Do people really do that?!) My life, job, marriage is great – I’m far from bored! I’m very happy. I’m not looking to fill any ‘hole’, I don’t feel maternal around babies, I like children (but happy to give them back!), have zero interest in making a mini me or keeping the family name alive, don’t believe (or want!) a child to look after me in later years etc etc..
But.. even though I can list 100 reasons not to have a baby there’s still a worry that I may 1 day regret a childfree choice. I feel 99% sure I want a childfree life. I just wish I was 100% about such a big life decision.
I have been absent for a while, but now I remember why I used to love this blog. Thank you, IЎ¦ll try and check back more often. How frequently you update your site?
Dearheart! We are updating this blog and re-birthing its value.I am proud to say my memoir, “Confessions of a Childfree Woman” is now available as an Ebook on Amazon.comn. The printed version soon follows.(Back cover is now in labor.) I am so happy to be here for you and will continue to do my best to support the joys of the childfree lifestyle. I am also here to answer any and all questions.HUGS!
Marcia
I just finished reading your book and know that you ARE a pioneer and hero for discussing the choice to be childfree with the public. I am a 54 year old woman and have been married to my husband for 32 years. I never contemplated having children; I have always known it was not the right choice for me. I was brought up in a dysfunctional family; a belligerant drunk for a father and an enabling mother. Neither of my parents had the necessary skills to raise children. They were able to provide food, shelter, and clothing which is about it. My husband is from a dysfunctional family, too. His father was a reclusive alcoholic and would leave the family to go on drinking binges. His mother was mentally ill and eventually his parents divorced. Our childhoods were very chaotic. I have experienced all the society pressures about my choice to be childfree and felt quite alone in our pronatalist society. However, I am a firm believer that parenting needs to have standards. Many parents are unfit and society will not discuss that issue. I remember a few years ago my mom was at a senior center and during a class the instructor asked all the participants, “If I asked your children to name something that you did that impacted them negatively what would they say?” My mother was very agitated with the question and answered “We taught our children that what happens in this house, stays in this house. So they would have nothing to say.” Is that mind boggling or what! It would be a great pleasure to be able to shine a light on the fact that so many parents are unfit and cause livelong problems not only for their children but for society, too. Thank you so much for all you’ve done.
I read the Mommyfriend article and didn’t find it tougne in cheek, but rude. I know unsolicited advice can be annoying, but tht comes from everyone not just the childfree. And you might be surprised just how many CF are tuned into parenting related places! As someone mentioned over there many of us are teachers and nannies and have some experience or at least an outside perspective. I know it can be tempting to offer it and to judge, but the condescension that you wouldn’t know the specialness of my child until -you- have given birth’ mitigates our choices. I have been learning about the kids in my people’s lives to understand them better, and all i ask is for the same consideration of my lifestyle. Life without kids can be just as hard, some of us are caring for sick parents, spouses or kids or have our own problems too. And it can be tough when the parents get preference for the holidays off, or special days to attend plays. I ask for the same consideration as a CF because I have family too (mothers, fathers, bros, and sis) and my pet gets sick occassionally. And someone has to not have kids to help balance the village. We are all people with our own choices. There are child places, please respect that there are adult places. And there are places for all ages and I am happy to see your kids there but please don’t expect me to be happy when they invade my space. I understand they are learning, but that is also why they are accompanied by adults. I liked this article. The author didn’t just blame the cf. And as a cf I can really empathize the pain of being rejected by a society for not following it’s strict standards. Parents get judged for not being perfect as we get judged for not having kids. We all have a beef with it, and we can change that together. And that thought brings me hope. (Sorry about the length, maybe I should’ve just blogged a reply somehow!)
Wonderful. Let me know what you think about the list. Isn’t it terrific to see so many things available? When I was younger, all I had was “The Baby Trap, by Ellen Peck. love being here for anyone seeking support.Being an “older” woman, I have lived this lifestyle for many years. If you have any questions, don’t hesitate to ask.
Marcia
Hi Marcia,
I have just finished reading your memoir and must tell you how much I loved it. I found it to be very well-written, and is in a style that gives the book a feeling that you are speaking personally to the reader.
I really appreciate your honesty and openness about living with the choice to remain childfree. It is still a difficult choice to live with for women today, as it is still largely unaccepted by wider society, and I truly believe that you have indeed been one of the ‘pioneers’ for other women in the same situation. I’m grateful for women like you who have had the courage to speak out about parenthood as a choice, you have definitely helped to create more acceptance for the childfree, and as hard as it still is to live with this choice today, I’m sure it was even more difficult for women of your generation.
As a 28 year old married woman who has made the decision not to have children, it is very important to me to hear about others who have chosen this life and have no regrets.
The possibility of being alone as I age is a very real fear for me, as is the risk of regretting my choice. It is very heartening and encouraging to come across other childfree women who are a little further down the road than me and are still happy with their lives.
Thank you so much for sharing your experiences with the world!
PS. I was pleasantly surprised to read at the end of your book that you and your husband have a chihuahua – my husband and I are also lucky enough to be owned by one of these wonderful little dogs, and his life (and our cat’s) is more than enough responsibility for us!
Kat, you have no idea what the words you shared mean to me. Taking time to tell your story and thank me is why I wrote this book. We, the childfree-by-choice, should be as proud of our choices as any parent. I urge you to live your life with joy and commitment to making it as good as you can. Reach out to the many children who are waiting for mentors or big sisters. (Some of them have been born into families where parenting was never considered a career!) Do this only if you enjoy kids! Or, help another organization you love. Be friends with many different people and ages. Plan for your future carefully regarding money. Let me know, from time to time, how I can help. Which chapter did you like the most and why did it help you? Don’t forget to share your reactions with others on social media.If you leave a review on Amazon.com, it will help more to read and gain the way you have.
Marcia
I have known about it since I was 12, even made a bet with my dad at 15 that I wouldn’t have kids before I reached 30. I got sterilized at 27 (I am from 1984) and I guess the bet is off because I cheated? It was a 1000 dollar bet, but hey! My parents gained more of my time to hang out with them because I don’t have kids to look after. (Now the question is if that is a good or a bad thing for them?)
You made me laugh! (I like that feeling.) I hope you used the money for a fun experience.
As for your parents having more time with you because you’re childfree, only they can answer.
If they have friends who chided them because they’re not grandparents, that may be another story.
Parents often feel cheated when they can’t get the icing on the cake of parenting which is supposed to be grandkids. Of course, there’s never any thought that a grandchild changes from that baby to a snarky teen. They can bring unhappiness through being non-responsive, or worse yet, choosing drugs or alcohol.
Thanks for taking the time to post!
Thank you Audrey. I agree. We need more and more people sharing honest feelings about not wanting to have children. We need more people telling how they still are lead to feel “less than” for the important choice not to parent.
Do you have any idea what your sweet words mean to me?
What chapter did you like the best and why? Thank you Amber. You just made my day!
Did you see the call for nominations for International Childfree Man and Woman of the year on my blog?
Hugs!
Marcia
Oh yes, many of those reasons from the fact I’ve just never had that urge to wanting to spend my time doing what I want to do to the astronomical amount of money it costs to raise a child. I saw the moms in the park and as much as I’m glad they made the right choice for them and followed their own desire to have kids, I didn’t connect with that feeling. There are still many things in life left for me to experience for the first time that I don’t find a need to go back and re-experience things vicariously through a child.
I didn’t see Michael’s comment as directed toward the childless or childfree, but as a description of herself personally. For her, she felt she was immature and selfish before having children, and now she feels she’s not. I would tend to think that having her own fitness business and helping many people achieve their fitness goals is the opposite of selfish, but who knows what she has going on in her personal life. If having kids helped her with that, great. I don’t mind when people make that statement for themselves if that’s how they really feel. What I mind are the people who point fingers and say that we are selfish and/or immature simply because we don’t have kids.
I’m not opposed to helping out parents when I selectively choose to do so, but it shouldn’t be an obligation. I’m reminded of the Bill Maher quote “I’m tired of being constantly, involuntarily deputized into the fight to keep your kids away from adult pleasures. ‘It takes a village.’ That’s just a saying. Us other villagers are busy, okay? I have other things to do in the village.”
Maybe it’s true that parents in American don’t get as much assistance as in some other countries, but they do get benefits. In her article she says “Americans segregate our kids from larger society, not receiving much assistance from the community, more than pretty much everywhere else in the world.” I would have to disagree with the first part. Kids aren’t segregated from society. There are many places where kids get in free, restaurants where kids eat free, and so many businesses pride themselves on being “Family Friendly” which is fine BUT when a restaurant or lounge explicitly sets themselves up as being an Adult Only venue, parents get upset. I like kids, but there are times when I want to go somewhere that I know they’re not going to be, and the options for that are often limited.
Not having kids doesn’t mean you can’t go to to an amusement park (although I guess it does mean you can’t ride the kiddy rides, but if you’re into that you could always offer to take a friend or relative’s child with you). My husband and I went to Legoland Deutschland without kids in tow and we were definitely in the minority. But we also got to see what we wanted to see and do what we wanted to do and didn’t have to walk slowly and take a bunch of walking breaks or say “no” a thousand times when they want to buy everything in sight. There is nothing on that list I couldn’t do a version of without children if I were so inclined.
Again, I agree with you my childfree sister! Sometimes, I wonder if people who write these things are trying to convince themselves they made the right choice!(LOL)
Haha I have heard that “but women were put on this planet to have babies” argument before. Yes we are biologically designed to have that ability, but we’re also designed to be able to make our own choices. Just because I can do something with my body doesn’t mean I HAVE to do it. It’s an option, and not one I’ve elected to choose.
Here Here! Well said. Another thing to think about is how awful those woman feel who think they were placed on this planet to have a baby and are infertile or have husbands with a low sperm count. The amount of money and challenges they go through to be considered “normal” is terrible, in my opinion. Thanks for taking the time to share.
Great post! I laughed out loud a few times. Acne making you feel young, really? How young you feel is 100% based on your thoughts. If you have positive thoughts like “life is exciting”, “possibilities are endless”, or “I’m open to learning” then you will feel young. If you’re thinking is negative like “life is hard”, “people are bad”, or “I don’t feel good” then you will feel older regardless of how old the calendar says that you are.
I agree, Allison. I laughed as I wrote the counter-point too. Sometimes, you just sit back and have to laugh, right?
Have you read my memoir? If so, what did you enjoy the most? If not, go stand in the corner. (ONLY KIDDING!)
Cyber-space Hugs,
Marcia
I’m one of they guys and I’ve been given some of the flack listed in the video. I’ve gotten the reverse of you’ll make such a great mom. I got: “You’d make such a great dad” One thing that should be listed from the guys: “How can you deny a woman a chance to become a mom?”
Yes Andrew. Too many times the men are not included in understanding the pronatalistic pressures they receive. You would never be denying a woman a chance to become a mom if you let your wishes be known from the start.In my opinion, from the get-go, it should be known you prefer to live a childfree lifestyle. And, you can also make sure, if you’re not against it, that you would support being a mentor, joining Big Brothers/Sisters or being an active aunt or uncle if there are other children in either family. I would also suggest that woman read some of the awesome books on this topic! Too many feel it’s a biological need and have no clue about what parenting really is.You have to be true to your own needs and wants, right?
Denver doesn’t have childfree dining yet. My husband and I are advocating for it on our website. I would think businesses would get the hint and create childfree hours or ban children outright under a certain age. They would do tons of business and make a lot of profit. They seem so scared of parents that they will not take this courageous step.
Hi Cynthia: (I must check out your website!) As for dining in peace, it’s amazing how defensive parents are to the word “Ban”. It’s as if we are taking a personal attack against their children. All we are looking for is a place we can enjoy our dining experiences without the challenges children may bring.I also wish for childfree zones on beaches and pools!
Hugs,
Marcia
Discovered your blog today and love it! Then I saw the title of your book, No Children, No Guilt and have to have it. I’m 44 and never had children (by chcioe). I can’t begin to tell you the schtick I get for this chcioe. Also, because I don’t look my age, people still say things like, When you have kids of your own .l Really?!Can’t wait to read this. Thank you!
I’m a single young adult, so I rarley get the question, Do you have kids? Most of the time, when I do, a simple, No, is enough to end that topic of conversation. I have been lucky to not receive so much stigma (yet). My mom still does not understand my decision, though!
Your Mom is under the same pronatal influence to announce a grandchild. If she’s the only one who can’t show photos and share sweet stories, she feels as if she failed. HOoor her feelings. Keep yours as sacred and follow your own heart.
When I was interviewed with my ex-husband on “60 Minutes” my mother in law said to him, “What did we do wrong to raise you this way?”
There are no childfree restaurants in my area but I know that some places in Toronto are considering it. I will visit and probably a lot if they do change to childfree. I love the concept.
We who are childfree…. agree with you. Keep asking at every restaurant you go to whether or not they will also have a childfree area or time when no children are allowed. (Of course, that will not happen in fast food restaurants!)Keep asking to be seated away from children, too. Thanks for responding.
Yes that could be me talking at work and in social situations. I’ve had every single one of these statements said to me. Why can’t people just accept the fact that I am happy without having children? Why is it such a foreign concept to them?
Oh my lord. I made it only about 3-4 min. into the video. I couldn’t take it any longer. That is enough to make me want to stab my eyeball repeatedly with a fork. Thankful for Mirena and for my childfree life!
He seems sick or something… or maybe he is just an annoying baby.
Some kids are just like that, a pain all the time. I hope it gets better soon for her.
This was hilarious. I too have had all of these statements said to me throughout my life. I tell people now that ‘Being childfree is a decision made happily and responsibly. It isn’t an affliction. I loved the last question the cf woman was asked. “Do you like babies?” “I do but I can’t eat a whole one.” That line made me laugh most. 🙂
As you know we have discussed the topic of this article in depth. As I told you before and as you know I have studied the Holocaust since age 12 (coincidentally the same age I decided I never wanted children). Many female Holocaust survivors chose to never have children because they didn’t want to see those events happen to their children. Others were physically unable to have children due to their daily struggle to survive the camps which were designed to slowly kill people if they weren’t selected for death immediately upon arrival. There were also women who were scarred by medical experiments, specifically sterilization, which rendered them incapable of ever bearing a child.
I think the Rabbi who spoke to you was a very wise man. You have had a huge impact on so many children. Now you help young women decide whether they want to take on the huge responsibility of parenthood or not. You have impacted so many lives in a positive way.
I am a Christian and most of the abuse I have endured for my choice to be child-free has come from other so-called Christians. I have never let it bother me because I made a decision I will never regret unlike most parents who are lied to about how wonderful parenthood will be. They then discover that is definitely not the case.
Of all the ministers I have had over the years the female minister at my church is the first one that accepts and understands my choice. She is my age and is neither married nor has children. I have lost count of the parishes I left because I was harassed for being child-free.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on your trip to Europe and Jewish guilt. I think every religion believes its members should have children, just because that is what you do. They don’t have a valid reason for why that is the case though.
Love all the videos! I am childfree and have experienced these exact situations so many times. Thanks for making the videos. Much appreciated and so true!
Beautiful as the child (and as patient as you are, bless your heart) I think I would lose my mind. I’m contemplating having an expensive IVF procedure right now and you may have saved me thousands of dollars. But don’t worry – your baby will grow up and be fine. Maybe teething or something. Some days it’s just hard being a baby! And harder being that baby’s Mama. Take care.
Being a baby’s momma or father is a very, very demanding responsibility. Remember, the life and time of that baby is but a fraction of a human’s life. It’s not just the “baby”. It’s everything involving the care of that human. For myself, and many choosing the childfree lifestyle, life is fine without biological or adopted children. It’s very freeing to admit you may “lose your mind” hearing that primal screams of a child. I respect you for that honesty.
No, definitely not. One of the major reasons why we don’t have children is finance. We earn enough to be a little more than sufficient, but I know for sure we would become poor if we have children, unless we sell our home for a smaller place and stop saving for retirement, then we might be able to afford having children. But of course, these actions are unheard of and unwise. Basically, both of us have a stable job, but due to the current economic climate, salary increment simply has not caught up with inflation, so our net income has actually reduced. If we still insist on having children under these financial circumstances, then I believe our actions would be very irresponsible.
Thanks for using my comment. Hopefully it will encourage more people, childfree or not, to give generously time or money! I’d like to start helping with serving the poor on Thanksgiving as well.
Congratulations on winning this award Marcia and for the difference you are making to people’s lives. Reading your book taught me a a lot. For example, the concept of legacy is often attached to children, reading your book, however, reminded me of the fact that legacy is also about our contribution to society and by extension the world. I read your book with great interest and highly recommend it!
Marcia, may God bless you today, tomorrow and forever. I have never believed in taking anything for granted and always say thank you for everything and I mean everything. Thank you for sharing your experience and for being an inspiration for others.
I am a Childfree woman (and soon to be step-mother to a 23 year old). I am also Jewish. I constantly struggle to feel as though I belong at Temple, I’m the only woman my age (late 30s) without kids. I feel like I have “done my part” as I have been a pediatric oncology Nurse and a school teacher. Your Rabbi’s words resonated with me, It’s something those of us who have made the CHOICE to remain childfree need to be reminded of.
Thank you.
I hope this gets to you! I’ve been remiss in answering my blog!
To know I’ve reached another heart is a gift .
You HAVE done a lot as a pediatric oncology nurse! How lucky for those children and their parents.
Many thanks for sending me this response. HUGS!
PS: Do you know about our childfree group cruise this December? Email me at nokidcruise@gmail and I’ll send info!
I just read “Confessions” and thank you! My brother-in-law essentially black-listed me for not wanting to marry & raise kids because HE worked all his life at a job he didn’t like to fulfill his family obligations. I said I’d rather have a dozen abortions than wish that on myself or marry some loser (I had lousy taste). He, a good RC–who never goes to church–was so upset he didn’t even say goodbye as I left the house. I hadn’t seen my sister–or him–in 10 years as they live across the country. No wonder I moved. My lawyer said he & his wife practice “voluntary extinction”, too well-educated to bring kids into this polluted world. Thanks again, loved the book, made perfect sense to me.
Christel, I apologize for not getting back sooner. This site was severally hacked. It took months to get it back! We are born into families. We can choose to remain a victim of their ignorance or love those accepting us just the way we are. We are fine people. It’s simply a lifestyle choice. Thank you for sharing with me and buying the book! Now, share it with pride and feel free to write to me any time. We are having another CF group cruise in December! Interested? Go to NOKIDCRUISE@gmail.com and place your name of the list. Hope to meet you in person. HUGS! Marcia Drut-Davis
So sorry it took me this long to respond. My site was severely hacked!
Your words make me feel wonderful knowing I helped your life. Thanks for sharing.
The “loss” you mentioned isn’t. Wrap your heart around those who love you.
Would you consider coming with us on our next Childfree group cruise? Write to me at nokidcruise@gmail.com if interested.
Hugs!
Marcia
As a CF woman, I’ve come across your story a few times on CF blogs and forums. I think you were brave to “come out” at a time when society was so hostile toward CF people. Thank you for sharing your story. I haven’t even told my family I’m CF but I guess I’m gonna have to soon, since I’m married and just turned 30 haha
Would you be interested in checking out a new childfree website? I’ve just launched a childfree dating/networking website earlier this week. 50 people have signed up so far.
I frequent a few childfree forums and I keep coming across these stories of childfree people dating and receiving judgmental messages from strangers on dating sites and being incessantly questioned by intrusive dates. There have even been many stories of long-term relationships falling apart because the non-CF partner has been waiting for the CF partner to change his/her mind the whole time. All these stories sound horrible.
I met my husband when we were in our early 20s and we decided to be CF together. I know I’d be going through the same thing if I didn’t luck out with my relationship.
So that’s how I decided to build a website just for CF people to find one another. Wanting or not wanting kids is a dealbreaker issue and there needs to be a place where CF people can date and get into relationships without the fear that their partner secretly wants kids.
I launched YesChildfree on reddit’s /r/childfree and I got some feedback that the CF people who already have partners would also like to be able to use it to find friends. It gets tough to find CF friends as you get older. So I expanded YesChildfree to allow for couples and people who are just looking for friends.
I know several childfree dating sites have closed down because there’s not enough members or funding. I’ve deliberately designed YesChildfree to be simple and economical. That way, I can keep it running for as long as it takes to build a large enough database for it to be self-supporting.
I mean, there are dating sites out there for horse lovers, clowns, cat lovers, bikers, gluten-free people, baby/diaper fetishists, hot sauce aficionados, sea captains, salad lovers, farmers, Star Trek fans, and people who think they’re vampires. I refuse to believe childfree people are more niche than them. 😉
When you have the time, please check out YesChildfree. If you like it, maybe consider joining us or adding it to your resources ebook.
Thank you! Hope you’ll like the site.
Best,
Dee
PS. You may want to fix the missing form on your Contact Me page. I first tried that page and was a bit stumped when I didn’t see a form, until I explored your site a little more. 🙂
Thanks for contacting me. I’m thrilled to see yet another source to help those choosing the CF lifestyle.Finding like-minded singles seems to be quite a challenge! I’ll surely go to your cite! I’m not that familiar with reddit!
Go to my group cruise email: nokidcruise@gmail.com. I’ll answer there.
The sad fact remains that society still is hostile to those choosing this lifestyle. Yes. More don’t face the criticism or shunning from family and friends. However, it’s still considered to be a selfish,irresponsible choice.
I’m hosting a CF group cruise next December, 2016. Perhaps we should talk about reaching singles together?
I’ll have my social media person check out that form you mentioned! Thanks for that heads up.
HOpe to speak soon.
Marcia
My husband and I organize a child-free MeetUp group … so of course we’ve scheduled a celebration event for Tuesday night!! Thanks for promoting this holiday that is worthy of celebrating!
Until I read this, I didn’t realize some people would not consider me childless by choice. I have married 2 men who had children, they were not mine. We attended family events and got along well, but that is nowhere near having children. I am a popular aunt, but chopse when I am involved in their lives. My choice. I choose childfree. Your life choices are your own. I hope to join one of your nokid cruises someday.
Denise, you just made my day! Of course stepparents can be childfree by choice! Instead of banding together and facing the wrath of too many, we are being divided by extremists. SOUND FAMILIAR?As for our gala cruise, I have a few cabins left for this next one December. I also just blocked cabins for next December, too.r to me at NOKIDCRUISE@gmail.com.
Sending hugs!
I just found this! Thanks so much for sharing. Of course it’s totally different with the label of Step-parents Vs Parent. There’s not one way I would consider them to be the same. I spent time with the step-daughters as a friend. They never accepted my friendship and were fed lies from their mother. It was a rude awakening how people may feel when they try to do the right thing, and fail! The worst art was when people from within the childfree lifestyle accused me of being a sham for once being labeled as a step-mother. SIGH! I”m now booking the next cruise! Go to NOKIDCRUISE@gmail.com and I’ll send you the info!
Having read this I believed it was rather enlightening.
I appreciate you finding the time and effort to put this information together.
I once again find myself personally spending way too much
time both reading and commenting. But so what, it was still worth it!
Our next cruise has dozens of supporters of the childfree lifestyle. We also have one mom, grandmom and friend who are parents supporting their heart connections to childfree people on board!
The guest speakers include: a young woman who chose sterilization at the age of 24, a man speaking from his heart, a life-coach and me! I’ll share the infamous “60 Minutes” fiasco that catapulted me into reaching you.
A world renowned Reiki Healer is joining us called to this group. (Only for those who feel they need her help!)
INFO: marciadavis@ketravel.com.
Feb 2-9, 2020
Norwegian Cruise Lines
Prices, right now, start at under 900.00 pp for an inside cabin.
FREE DRINKS?
FREE SPECIALTY DINING?
FREE AIRFARE?
FREE SHORE EXCURSIONS?
FREE ON-BOARD CREDIT?
It depends on cabin choices!
But even more important is being with like-minded people. It’s magical!
Just say, “Well….you may be right!” Notice…I’m NOT saying they ARE right! I’m giving permission for them to be right because they will never be wrong! Then, walk away and giggle because this is the best lifestyle on the planet!
There are more and more people making the choice to live a child free life. It’s amazing when we can find other CH individuals through social media and be able to offer support and a judgement free listening ear to each other.
Thank you so much for being in part of the childfree movement.
Being childfree, I always get abused from social pressure. Family, friends, and partner don’t understand me and often try to change, put pressure and guilt me to be “the norm”.
I was often confused about who I am. I’m so grateful to find you and knowing that I’m not alone. Be able to accept that I’m just the “left-handed person in the right-handed society” and don’t feel guilty about being true to myself.
That’s how everything should be in this world. People being treated equally and respectfully regardless of race, gender, and everything else.
It’s truly amazing that pronatalistic prejudice has so greatly and completely infiltrated our society thru our media. News celebrates multiple births (more like litters), peanut butter is sold only to “choosy Moms”, car commercials are sure to show families including children, even suppositories that are taken by adults somehow make the children happier. If you don’t have children, you don’t exist. I think this sucks! What does anyone else think?
Just wanted to direct you to an interesting blog in the NY Times, and an entry from a few days ago on the topic of Aging Without Children. http://newoldage.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/aging-without-children/
Pin my tail and call me a donkey, that relaly helped.
Another post not making sense and the first time I’ve seen it. Sorry to those reading this.
I have NO idea how this post appeared. It’s the first time I’ve seen it and would have erased it because it doesn’t make sense.
Thanks Maida. I read that piece and found it interesting how people worry about getting older and not having children to care for them. That’s a myth. Visit any nursing home and you’ll see how many children are visiting their parents. Not just because they don’t care! Some live too far away! Some are too busy in their careers or their own children’s lives. Saving, investing and planning for your own financial future should be a priority. I also treasure my friendships with my women friends and daughter,son/friends and show people how much knowing and connecting to them is valued. I think about my husband who has two grown daughters who’ve discarded him. There are no guarantees.
This is so true. I once told a co-worker I thought I might need to have a kid so someone would be there to take care of me. Although I was joking, she quickly said that would be no guarantee. She lost a child very young and the surviving child was an addict she cared for. There are no guarantees. If you don’t have children, you’ll have more money to save to care for yourself in old age.
Keep on wriitng and chugging away!
That’s not just the best anwser. It’s the bestest answer!
Umm, are you really just gviing this info out for nothing?
Yes.
I chose to have children and I am glad I did, but I thoroughly believe it is a choice that is an individual matter and involves no one but the individual and their partner. I have three children and only one chose to become a parent.
My life does not hang on someone elses choices. We should each live our lives for ourselves to the best of our abilitly and we will go a long way in creating a world of peace for all.
I think it’s wonderful that you have expressed who you are, your feelings and what has worked in life, specifically for you! The very best to you on the completion of your new book!
Marcia
God, I feel like I suhold be takin notes! Great work
Thanks. Sorry I just read this! I would have caught the spelling error but that’s not important. You can take notes and always feel free to ask me anything.
Great comomn sense here. Wish I’d thought of that.
If you’ve chosen to parent, remember this for your own children. Allow them to make choices that are right for them and not imposed on by society.
Thanks for standing up for the childless, Marcia! I have so many people have children without considering all the implications, only to find themselves in over their heads. I am a proud aunt and see the joys children can bring, however I’ve seen how the children can suffer when parents are not prepared. Children deserve parents who are ready to nurture them. And we owe it to ourselves not to enter into parenthood lightly.
Leslie, thanks for this comment. Do you or anyone reading this blog….think people are sufficiently prepared to parent?
I do not believe any person is sufficiently prepared to be a parent. I think the only ways a person can prepare is to be financially ready for a child and to be ready to love and support any person selflessly.
You hear parents giving other persons or other parents advice about how they raised their child(ren) and they act as if that is the only way. However, I believe parenting involves adapting. There is a saying every person is different; every baby is different and the growing process for every child is different. There are many factors to consider, but a person can only prepare themselves by being ready to conquer every challenge that may come with being a parent and parenting.
I agree. There’s another way to prepare and that’s to honestly ask yourself if you want the career of parenting. In this society, and indeed others worldwide…. it’s a hard thing to ponder because parenting is bathed in so many unrealistic myths.
It’s like you’re on a misison to save me time and money!
What is wrong with a country that requires you to study, pass and exam, get a license before your can drive a car… A country that you have to get a license for your pet, put some serious effort into adopting a shelter animal and adopting a child — but you can freely get pregnant have a child with out any preparation or requirements to keep it? hmmm… If you don’t want it after you get it you can put it up for adoption or sale or just drop it off at a police station… and this is after the pre-natal care and hospitalization was already picked up by medicaid. hmmmm
This is the first comment on my blog I’ve seen in a long time that I LOVE! Let’s add another question: “What’s wrong with a country where you HAVE to be licensed to teach, become a doctor or attorney drive a bus yet never asked to pass anything about becoming a prospective parent?” Thanks so much for this. I am still trying to get ONE agent or publisher interested in my memoir. I keep seeing rejections with: “No big deal today! Anyone can still not have kids and it’s perfectly OK!” Until the childfree lifestyle is given as much acceptance to parenting, more and more will want the societal acceptance of having or raising children.
I apologize to anyone reading this. I didn’t know how to delete back then!
I have two children from a previous marriage. Parenting doesn’t always follow the “Grand Plan”. They grew up to be educated, professional women. We had a special relationship until I divorced their mother. Since then, the relationship has stopped and they are no longer a part of my life. I have not been invited to any wedding. I have grandchildren that I don’t know and, that don’t know me.
There are no guarantees that your children will value what you do (or sacrifice) for them or, stay in your life. When you choose to have children, don’t assume it all works out “happily ever after.” Many people choose to have children believing their children will always be there for them, just as they were there for them. Yet, when you go to assisted living facilities, many parents spend their last years alone. Sometimes, reality bites!
In my opinion, there’s nothing worse than being discarded after doing the best you could do as a parent. Concentrate on the good you know you did for them. Remember those freeze-framed moments when they gave you happiness or you embraced and enjoyed your role as their loving, committed father. They are independant women, on their own, with decent careers and education. You can’t rationalize with angry people unwilling to honor the love you gave or who refuse to go for help to eliminate that anger.
I do not believe the choice of having children should be based on the expectation that in return your children are to take care of you because you’re their parent. I believe having children, being a parent and parenting should be a selfless act.
My husband and I were recently married. We’ve been together for almost 10 years. We hope to have children soon, but we want to have children as a symbol of our love to each other as well as we want to give our love to another human being who we can encourage and support as well as educate them the best we can from what we’ve learned through our years in all of our different roles: as a child, as a brother, as a sister, as a student, etc.
Parents can only hope that if they give their child(ren) the right teachings and all of their love and support that the child(ren) will return the love when parents need it most, but if they do not, it does not represent a failure in the parenting or that the child(ren) are terrible person(s). I believe parents can only do their best in raising their child(ren) and a lot of what happens in the future is out of their control.
Thanks for this post. I agree that no expectations should be the rule if you choose to parent. Actually, the “no expectations” helps in all of life, doesn’t it? Unfortunately, too many people are bathed in the myth that children will love them forever.
There’s one thing you wrote which I want to comment on: having a child as an expression of your love for each other. A child doesn’t do that. That’s part of the myth. How you continue to treat each other day after day is a better way of expressing that beautiful goal. In my opinion, the only reason for having a child is because you love the career’s requirement, feel you are parent material and have the money.
QUESTION: Are there any other parents out there who feel they’ve been discarded?
I have two kids and love being a mom. Sometimes its hard. I have my days where I just want to scream and run because they drive me crazy! But, then when they tell me they love me it just melts my heart. Being a mom is not for everyone. I know people that dont want to have kids like my cousin. Her parents are very uspet with her. They feel that there is something wrong with her who would not want to have kids!! I tell the parents get off her back! Leave her alone! This is her choice. I feel like motherhood is not for everyone just like marrage is not for everyone. I give a lot of credit to people that speak up for themself and what they believe is a good life for them. Just because I like something doesn’t mean someone else has to like that also.
I see, I spsupoe that would have to be the case.
I know a woman that I have been very close to for the last 4 years. Her husband just died. Her kids put her in to a nursing home and they dont really visit her. Ii go there to see her 2x a week with my kids.It breaks my heart that she had 4 kids and she took care of them when they were sick. She loved them, provided for them; now those kids cant take care of one mother! I think its very sad she is not my family member.I love her. She’s been good to my kids and me. I cant even imagine if i didnt go there to see her. Ii just dont know how her kids sleep at night.
I have three children and five step-children from two other marriages. What a joy it’s been to have them in my life…yes….there were sacrifices and sometimes I wanted to run away, especially when five of them lived with me. But I am a very lucky woman: each of these wonderful beings have become my adult friends, and I am so lucky to be part of their lives. For me, the choice was simple at the time I made it…but every person has the right to make their own choices. I am also glad that my children made the decision to have children…selfishly, I have 13 grandchildren to spoil and to love. More importantly, I have the opportunity to see what great parenting skills my kids have, and to witness the strong relationships they have developed with their own children. Having children was the right decision for me…but it’s not right for everyone.
Those of us who choose not to parent are truly happy for you and those who feel made the right choice. It’s all about choices… and the consequences. Do you or anyone out there feel you are prepared for those consequences whether it’s to parent or not to parent? If your children had not had children…. by choice, how would you have felt?
Is anyone out there who has grandchildren and are DISAPPOINTED in them? Please tell us about that.
Realistically, not every couple is designed nor qualified to be nurturing and competent parents. But how will the members of the qualifying committee be chosen??? Until then, anything goes. Hopefully each person will decide if this lifetime engagement is right for a lifelong journey.
Of course, there must be freedoms to choose about whether parenting is a career you want. However, in my opinion, it’s one of the most important careers of a lifetime. Do you, or anyone, feel people are getting educated to question whether or not this career is for them? Do you think the schools are doing their job? I will open another discussion about this on the POSTS.
Very interesting topic and very timely; there is an increasing number of women that cant get pregnant . Although I have kids and I cant imagine my life without them I can understand women that decide to go childless; it is a personal choice and this country is all about personal choices.
Infertility is an agonizing challenge. I’ve heard from so many men and women struggling with it’s emotional and physical toll. I’ve often spoken to infertile support groups who at first, see me as a threat. However, after I’ve spoken, see a new way to fight. They switch from the sentence of being childless to being “childfree”. This takes them away from being a victim to being more in control of how they live their lives.
I’m thrilled you are happy with your choice to parent.
Please excuse the length of this piece, but the complexity of these ideas precludes brevity. Succinctness is the best I can hope for.
The issue of pro-natalism manifests in each culture in a particularly idiosyncratic way. Regardless, there is the universal drive to maintain the community and those people, who conform, satiate this cultural imperative, while those that choose not to comply with this dictum are looked upon as not supportive of the general welfare. These are not conscious perspectives but reside within the social unconsciousness of people as living beings. When viewed this way, there is no surprise that pressure to have children exists, or that people who do not to have children, whether by choice or circumstance, experience marginalization, . This simply is the way it is. This is not to justify the social judgment but rather to accept the reality of it.
While historically, all cultures have promoted procreation to ensure continuity, the fundamental biological imperative, the peculiar way found in American society, reflects multiplicities that are our own. The materialistic exploitation of this fundamental social imperative is so characteristically American, that this too, should not come as a surprise. Every social value has at some point in our history been used to make money. The commercialism of America is intrinsic, it’s like Mom’s apple pie, as so clearly described by de Tocqueville in 1830. Nothing much has changed since then except its contemporary pervasiveness throughout all levels of our society through the “media”. But it is nothing more than a re-iteration of the underlying social ethos.
What is important now, as reflected in Marcia’s advocacy, which is a departure from traditional perspectives, is that the appreciation of a new degree of social freedom available to us. We can now choose not to have children without having to be isolated from our partners. We can live full lives of our own choosing, in the actualization (don’t really like this term, but it fits) of our individuality, in full existential, sexual and emotion connection, without the anxiety of potential child bearing. The technology of contraception, in a variety of forms, enables new opportunities of being within the social community.
As with any new freedom, it should not be unexpected that it will meet with approbation from the community at large. But the struggle to articulate the new perspective is essential to the growth of this community as it enlarges the total possibilities for not only the members of the dominant social environment, but the potential for all, to aspire to greater prosperity (not just material but more importantly, personal). It brings into consciousness responsibility for one’s actions.
The sense of distress for those making this choice is real, considering the considerable social pressures to have children. For this reason, the articulation of this perspective by Marcia is especially poignant at this time. There are too many children who have to address the issues of inappropriate intentions of their parents, whether of men demonstrating sexual prowess, women seeking love or looking to create objects of love, or succumbing to social pressure, or as in my case, an attempt to keep a failing marriage intact, (lucky me, it worked out fine and I’m glad to be here). Many poor intentions, much suffering, some successes.
Several people have responded in this forum in the context of their experiences as parents and its value, or as non-parents and the consequences, hopefully, of that choice. I have my own experiences as a parent, and grandfather which have been beyond expectation, but they really don’t bear on what I consider the core issue of Marcia’s advocacy of freedom of choice in child bearing and parenting. Being a parent is an opportunity not an obligation. There are an infinity of opportunities in our lives. It is most important that we choose wisely as the consequences, especially when they create new beings who have to live with them, have profound effect for all of us.
A very profound and welcomed post, David.Thanks for taking the time. Can you please go to the question I posed about PARENTING EDUCATION.
I would love to see you comment. Can we “choose wisely” when we are victims of pronatalism or are forced to face myths surrounding those who don’t want to have children?
Here’s what I’ve heard… and still do:”But, aren’t you just selfish? Who will take care of you when you’re old? What if everyone feels the same way?
You asked for it, here it is.
Before addressing the question of preparedness for parenting, it seems necessary to distinguish between parenting, bearing and having children. These are not synonymous terms, but rather reflect quite different sets of actions and intents.
Leaving the first for last; child bearing may be considered as the actions up to, and including, the birthing of a child. It sets the ground for all subsequent events. What we want to consider most important in this discussion is the intent leading this momentous action. Whatever the motivation producing this intent, we should recognize that for most people, this is simply the way of having children and parenting them in a family, whether from emotional injunction or social conformity. However, it must be recognized that for others the intent is different. For some men it is a way of demonstrating virility; for some women it enables their womanhood, a rite of passage; some do it to exploit a welfare system; and some do it out of ignorance.
Let me be personal for a moment to elucidate one scenario in my experience. When I remarried, I already had two children and having had a vasectomy, had no wish to have any more children. However, my wife, who had earlier in her life decided not to have children, via two abortions, decided that now she wanted to have a child. Eventually, at age 40, through the technique of artificial insemination, she did have a baby. While the actual pregnancy and birth (a bit complicated but with a satisfactory outcome) were successful, the subsequent times were extremely stressful. She did tell me later, that she had had no idea of “having” a child and all the demands it made upon her life, rather it was the experience of bearing a child that motivated her. I bring this up to illustrate the ambiguity of intention without a consciousness of consequences.
This brings us to “having” children. For most people I suspect the intent of having children is to create a “connected” family, but let it recognized that for some, having children is the manifestation of wanting to be “normal”, being seen as within the community. The ambiance of family and responsibility of parenting are simply the reward and obligation of conforming. Participation can be quite perfunctory, fulfilling a role in society. This is a situation I have observed in my years of going, on a recurring basis, into peoples homes . It satisfies a social need of “parents”. Remarkably, it is often successful in producing successful children, mostly due to the resilience of the children, reflecting their ability to survive and prosper, regardless of the actual environment. A tribute to the tenacity of life.
Now, parenting. This is another scale of being. Staying in the fractal of being, parenting leaps to another state of complexity with retention of pattern, but with new unique, elaborations, not simple reflections of past experience, but creation of new realities. The opportunity for growth of self through transcendence of self as sole subject through the experience of subject to subject. Parent to child as shared presence. (These are terms I’m employing in a paradigm of “narcissism“, perhaps necessarily to be more fully explicated, to be understood).
My biological children are now 42 years old and 40 years old. Over many years I have struggled to maintain relationship to them. It has been successful. The intent was always clear, through the early years, divorce, remarriage, adulthood. I love these children and they some how sensed it. Even when the situations were conflicted I showed up, sometimes supportive and sometimes critical. They always experienced acceptance. They appreciated that it took some moves of mine to adjust and they adjusted too. This is the lesson I have to give. My son is not going to have children but he knows how to love his lady, giving her space, support and accepting of her love. My daughter, who has taken me into her home, in my own space, is more conventional, with a wonderful man as a partner-husband, son-in-law, two children (my grandchildren, lovely people), two cats, a puppy, gold fish and six chickens. We’ve had our confrontations and survived and prospered. I feel I have been a good parent because my children are good people. This is a great validation of me, my place in being.
Now this takes us to another place, being a parent to a child that is not only not my biological child but one resisted into being. When my second wife decided to have a child, regardless of the intent, I resisted vigorously. Applying the arguments, “I have had children. I don’t want to do it again”. “Yeah, well, you had your chance and now I want mine”, “I’m too old (almost fifty) and so are you (forty); who wants old people as parents with impaired energy”, “I’ll deal with it”. No range for compromise. Well, it happened, Graham was born and I had already made the decision that no child, given the opportunity, should not have a father present. I was a child who never experienced a father (good thing for me, as my father was better not known to my child). Still, the idea that a child should have such an empty compartment in their being was repellent to me. Fortunately, by fathering my first children I was given me the opportunity to realize the father to me. A great teaching and blessing to wholeness. Graham is now twenty two years old, a splendid person, bright, appreciative and loving. The recent thing he did was to have me listed on his Face Book page as his father. How proud can a person be to be acknowledged in this way.
So now we can address the question of parent preparedness. Nothing prepares us for being a parent. Knowing how to change diapers, hold a child, set boundaries, or entertain, can deal with the existential events of parenthood. Only by doing it can it be learned. Schools can’t teach it. It is not a career. It is not an endeavor. It is not a skill. It is an art. It is process, learned as we go along. It is a peculiar fabric of life, not for everyone, but for some, it gives a sensuality to life, a fullness of being. This cannot be transmitted, it must be experienced. I am a person who easily projects fearful experiences to be avoided, but some of life’s challenges require one to leap off of cliffs. Parenting is one of the cliff s in my life. I’m flying.
Hi Marcia…congratulations on your adventure. I’m signing in as 52 year old woman without children. I dont often reflect on not having children. I guess I embrace life and it just didnt happen. I blame infertility and meeting a life guy only at 38 years. I had some sense that I wanted a family including children but when it didnt happen I just didnt look back much.
Lately, I am connecting the dots of my life more, reflecting and I thinking a child would have been nice but I cope by just switching gears and embracing life without them. (sublimation they call this) I think my brother called me around age 38 and put the question to me, are you going to have kids but besides that I didnt feel a lot of pressure to conform. At a high school reunion a few years ago I found it interesting a lot of us women didnt have kids yet work in the health field. Perhaps nursing has given me a sense of caring and what its like to “parent” or take care of others like you as a teacher. I sometimes think it would be good to connect more with children as I get older. I heard about a group in Nova Scotia that has “elders” spending time with 2 year olds for a sense of enjoyment. So I think not having children is something I might do if I had the choice again but then again I’ve really had a great life and no regrets at the moment. Its really all about being engaged /connected to people of all ages and staying that way as we grow old gracefully, with or without children. Dont you think?
Thanks for getting me to stop and reflect on this part of my life. much luv & hugs
And I thought I was the sensible one. Thanks for setting me strigaht.
Also I enjoyed the other blogs …David Kaplan’s blog was excellent, I got a lot from it..the rewards of parenting, the ambiance of family life..I think I always was terrified of birthing and also didnt see the need to conform much to society and without the right man but still a lifesyle that included travel let time slip by. Thanks Marcia will check it again.
HI MARCIA,
I am also a product of the 50’s and 60’s and choose not to have children. For years people asked me if I could not have children or if it was totally my decision. I would always answer that it was my decision. I was married at that time and my husband also did not want to have any children. I have never regretted not having any although having been a teacher I think I would have been a good mother. My dedication for years has been animal rescue so I guess that is what fulfilled my maternal instincts.
Thanks Lori. So happy to know your choice was right for you. I question the whole topic of “Maternal instincts”.
If it’s so instinctive, why is there so much child abuse?
This is a wonderful website. Wish I had all the resources stated when I was making the decision to remain childfree. My husband and I chose not to have children and have not regretted the decision. We have been able to travel extensively and not have the stress that comes along with raising children. We enjoy spending time with our nieces and nephews and our friend’s children but always are glad to return to our childfree home. Parenthood is not meant for everyone and a person’s choice should always be respected. It seems that choosing a child free life style has become more accepted in recent years. When we were making the decision it was still looked upon as an unusual and sometimes selfish decision. I remember a friend saying that it was not normal not to want to have children. The sting of that comment remains with me to this day.
Thanks for this beautiful and heartfelt post. I, too, wish we had more support when I chose not to have children. I’ve learned that “stings” are possible only if we allow them to hurt us. Let that hurt go or you remain a victim of that comment.That comment you heard about you not being “normal” reflects the ignorance of people. When I lost my career because I was interviewed on “60 Minutes”, that “sting’ took another turn. Nobody should have to suffer that way because of misperceptions and ignorance. Being an “other’ in society is always challenging, isn’t it? Look at the topic of Maternal Instincts. I would love to read your reactions to that.Again, thanks for this post.
In my opinion, if there wasn’t an instinctual need to reproduce, our species would surely die out. Our society, however, has made us question our instincts…which isn’t necessarily bad… thoughts???
I aggree that without our biological inclination for reproduction, our species would die out. Of course! However, my question is more about whether or not we learn or acquire that need to reproduce through our society’s expectations, our how we feel about being accepted as a “normal person”.
I always felt an instinct was something inherently a part of us. If I chose not to reproduce, does that mean I never had that instinct? If a mother drives her kids into the water to kill them, has she lost that instinct?
Mighty useful. Make no mistake, I apprecaite it.
TYVM you’ve sloevd all my problems
Okay I’m convinced. Let’s put it to atcoin.
Ever since my children reached puberty, I had to deal with difficult personality issues with each child. I learned of negative genetic issues in my family. I have always been concerned that some of those negative genetic psychological traits would be passed down to the next generation. My concern is that my grandchildren will inherit some of those challenging traits. They can wreak havoc in the lives of the people they touch.
How could any of this be bteetr stated? It couldn’t.
I think that this blog is full of nonsense. It sounds more like everyone in here defending not having kids really does regret it. Or at least are always wondering “what if”? Why else would a bunch of old people have meetings that support their decision? Childbirth is a choice but this blog is full of people that are either regretful or bitter about their own kids. There wouldn’t be this blog if you were all happy about your decision.
Thanks for your comment Alex. You’re right! The need for this blog would never exist if everyone felt they were respected for a personal choice. Maybe there wouldn’t be this blog if people could accept the choice that not having children is as good and viable a lifestyle as having them? Did you know about many surveys asking parents, “If you had it to do all over again, would you have kids?” (The most famous was by Ann Landers in the 70’s where 70% responded with NO!) The July 2010 issue of New York Magazine featured, “I love my children. I hate my life!” I am happy for anyone who has children and enjoys that role. That’s the point! Kids need parents who are prepared and ready to parent. Too many times, we hear of tragic stories. There are too many children suffering because people choose parenting thinking it was their ticket to acceptance. Have you ever considered there are many unhappy parents who wonder, ” What if I never had them?” The sad fact, is…..it’s too late.(By the way, there are many posts from parents on this blog too.)
I am very happy to be a mom, my biological daughter is a joy, the good and the bad. What I wouldn’t choose for my life, if I could get a “do over” are step children. It’s hard enough to love and like your own sometimes but to deal with kids that aren’t your own, Dear Lord is all I will say.
Best of luck with your book Marcia!
I’m happy you have enjoyed raising your own child. (Even, as you say, during those “bad times”.) Being a step parent is an awesome challenge. We try to be accepted and be their friend. We never want to be that step-monster. Yet, we are there to offer guidance as well. Without any preparation, who can blame us for feeling bewildered in this role? Also, it takes two to have any relationship. When the stepchildren aren’t willing to meet you half way, frustration is bound to be there.If the stepchildren are hearing bad things about you, how do we face that? If the original Mom or dad is deceased, the anger that we’re trying to take their deceased parent’s roles hurts too deeply. I totally understand how you feel, Rose.
Your statement is very important. I have found people who say “Why bother about this topic? It’s “old”. On the contrary, it’s not old. Yes. It’s a more accepted choice. However, the reactions of too many people is to feel this choice is hedonistic, unloving, and as you say….selfish. It’s no more selfish than having children to fit into the norm. Or, having children to feel accepted. Or, having children to use as trophies of success. In the corporate or political world, the family man is still regarding with more admiration than the single or childfree man. The women claiming to have it “all” (meaning family and career) is a woman to aspire to. Thanks for your post, Sarah.
Very valid, pithy, suiccnct, and on point. WD.
This piece was cogent, well-wriettn, and pithy.
Your talk last night at Panera Bread in Stuart was great. Telling about your choice not to have children on “60 Minutes” was really interesting. It was amazing how that show changed your life, including your career, the threats to you and your dog. It was even more amazing how nothing was directed toward your husband. The open discussion and questions after your talk showed a real need to get this topic out into open discussion, maybe even a talk show. I can’t wait until I can get a copy of your book! How do we get you to speak at other organizations?
I have never, in all the years since I was interviewed on “60 Minutes, ever thought about the fact that my then husband, Warren…..never had anything against him for living a childfree lifestyle. I mean his business flourished. I lost a career as a passionate teacher! His life was never threatened; mine was!
As for having me talk, just email me at mdjd7@yahoo.com and we can arrange a mutually agreeable time. Thanks for asking.
Action reuqires knowledge, and now I can act!
Articles like this are an example of quick, hlfepul answers.
There are no words to decsirbe how bodacious this is.
Marcia,
Thank you for championing this subject. I think in our age and time, it’s an important option for woman who want to make educated choices in their life. Not to have children is an important option that is still suffering bad PR, and prejudice. Even though more and more choose not to procreate, many are still facing the concept they are “selfish”.
Sara
I think children are a big responsibility. So many teenagers these days are having children and they aren’t ready to have them. Whereas there are adults that can take care of them but can’t have any of their own. I’m 16, and i’ve encountered at least 4 pregnant teenagers that go/went to my school. Child birth is all about being ready to bring another life into this world, and many people aren’t ready. I, myself, haven’t decided on weather or not i want a child. If i do end up having one, it will probably only be one. It’s a very varied topic, and interesting too.
I am honored to have a 16 year old on my blog. How did you find this website? It would be interesting to know that answer.
Teenagers KNOW that a sperm and an egg can make a baby. Yet, both the boy and the girl don’t take precautions together not to get pregnant! In my opinion, It’s the responsibility of two people having sex.
Childbirth is only the act of bearing a child. It’s a mere second in a lifetime of raising a child. At this stage of your life, I would concentrate on your education. and remember, that “baby” is only a small part of a human’s life. Unlike yourself, many teens see that baby like the dolls they played with when they were little girls. Nobody wants to give birth to a teenager, right? When the time is right, this should be discussed between you and who will be your life partner. Actually, in this day and age, many women are choosing not to partner and raise a child alone. Again, at 16, enjoy your life and plan the future that best suites your needs. Thanks for this post.
My church is offering a series on “Overcoming disappointment with your children”. This topic is real yet no one tells you when you are seeking to be a parent that the day will come (and it will come) that you will not be happy with your childs life choices. Whether the disappointment is small and insignificant or large and life changing, the fact of the matter is, you just aren’t prepared for the hurt. We are made to believe that you have these beautiful bundles of joy and the life you have laid out before them (in your mind) may not be the life that materializes. They may NOT like school, they may NOT get good grades, they may NOT go to college, they may NOT want to get a good job, they may NOT even want to work. They may NOT even want to leave your couch. There are no guarantees that a happy, healthy, beautiful baby turns out to be a happy, beautiful, successful adult. Just like a big, expensive, elaborate (you really can’t afford it) wedding does not get you a successful, till death do us part marriage.
Yup, that’ll do it. You have my appecriatoin.
I think the desire to fly in a baby-free zone is talltoy legit and it\’s really not personally about anyone actively disliking any particular child, it\’s about enjoying peace and quiet.I\’ve been on flights with many a crying child, and while it isn\’t a picnic, I try to have sympathy for the parents, who are usually dealing with things the best they can. On only two exceptions have I been really upset at a child\’s behaviour -in both cases, the parents were letting the child entertain themselves by actively kicking and hitting the back of my seat, which was really not pleasant. In one case, I asked the child to stop their behaviour myself, which perhaps was overstepping a parental line, but I got absolutely no response from the parent (at least the kid stopped the kicking). So, parents, as long as your kid isn\’t actively smacking anyone\’s seat while you encourage them, you\’re probably good!
These topics are so cfonuisng but this helped me get the job done.
Such a powerful, honest and heart felt post. Those tiny bundles of joy are precious until they say their first “No!”. Or, until their choices don’t meld with your own expectations.You are right;nobody teaches how to adapt to these real experiences because there are no required preparations for the job of parenting.
I wonder what will be “taught” at this series in your Church. Keep me posted if you take it or know of anyone taking it.The trouble is these series or classes are often given after having children are born.Many chose having children to fit their own needs or wants. Or, they will go on trying to change their childrens dreams to fit their own. And, sadly, most will wind up very disappointed.
Short, sweet, to the point, FREE-eaxtlcy as information should be!
No more s***. All posts of this qaultiy from now on
I really don’t know how I feel about not having children. At 40 years old, I am looking back and regretting many stupid things I did as a young adult and the choices I made regarding having a family, husband, home etc. etc. I am not sure if I can rectify anything I have done or if I really want to. I see my friends having children in their late 30’s and early 40’s and say, maybe I could, but, then I hear children screaming outside, playing on a holiday when I would like peace and quiet and think…”KILL IT”…. (probably not the best thought to have if contemplating family….just sayin!!!) I am happy for all my friends who have embraced parenthood … and when I say parenthood and friends, I mean, men and women friends. Parenting takes two..despite what the books and media have told most. I think in order to have a well rounded child, it takes two parents. I see so many people have children and it kills their relationships, most of my friends are divorced, separated OR…Hate their spouse and resent them. I don’t think this is the kind of life I would like. I have enough trouble on my own in a relationship without the help of a waling child.
I know the adage of having a child so it can take care of you when you are old..but, I think as a child of two aging parents, it is a horrible thing to do to a child.. ask a child to care for me and clean up after me….completely SELFISH and miserable and if this is the reason you are having children, you better hang onto your bootstraps, because, said Slave, er, child, is going to rebel like hell and move about 1500 miles away from you and get conveniently busy when it comes time to schlep home and do your dirty work for you… I see more and more a lot of my friends who are dealing with aging parents or sick parents are becoming completely resentful and lashing out and writing horrible things on our wonderful social networks about how terrible their life is, and how they wish they were not around to take care of their parents and want to place them in a home.. and not in a funny, haha, sort of way, more like in a serious (if I had the money) sort of way…I myself do not think this, nor would I choose this, but then again, I don’t know what could happen in a few years down the road…
Having children is an important decision one must make.. it is not a matter to be taken lightly and in a haphazard manner.
I have read some of the comments here for and against, I don’t know whether I am for or against. Time will tell, I suppose.
It’s absurd that women and men assume they should have children. I chose not to have children. I am not and never have been sorry. It’s a personal decision. Why society pressures couples, particularly women, to breed is beyond me. Children are great, but not for me. I’ll never regret being child free. Many people I’ve spoken with (both men and women) have confessed they never really wanted kids, but succumbed to the pressure. I’ve always tried to live my life using my beliefs, not someone elses….more people should try it.
It warms my heart to hear you are taking on this controversial subject, shining a well needed light on it, in the form of a book. In doing so, you will leave your mark on this world and earn a very special reward for your effort… immortality. You will live on forever in the hearts and minds of those who read your thoughts.
If you want to give a lifetime gift to a friend…. Give An Interesting Book! I am sure yours will be interesting….
The very best on the BIRTH of your “first” book.
Thank-you for your blog. Even in 2011, being childfree is not considered a valid choice. I had a former friend ask this past year if my choosing not to have those babies was due to troubled childhood. Never mind that she was pregnant with her formerly-married lover’s baby and had dramedy going on with her own family! I get so tired of people wanting to think it is solely about my growing-up years.
I never wanted to be a mother since I could remember and before I realised my family was chaotic. Growing up in the 70’s, I saw how many women were discarded from marriage and how it was hard to collect child support back then. The divorced mothers struggled to eke out survival while the fathers were worshiped by my girlhood friends. I saw how the divorced mums also felt they had to accept so little from boyfriends as men with something going for them did not want a woman with extra mouths to feed.
I was never a maternal person and felt motherhood was a leghold trap. Even at a young age, babies and dolls did not interest me. It is not always about childhood, either. I know too many women from my youth who chose to be a mother so they could rewrite history by claiming how they would not do their kids the way they had been done by their parents. Sadly, history did repeat itself.
I am another one who never regretted saying “NO” to children. I got my tubes tied as a younger woman and am thankful every single day how I defied society. I have a decent life now. Had I followed what society and religion wanted, I would be forced to a McJob to feed children and have health coverage for them. The childfree choice should be offered as a viable option to women and men.
It warms my heart to read posts like yours. I’ve been told this is not a topic worth discussing as choice is now wide open. I beg to differ. Although more and more people are making this choice, if they go public, the reactions may not be so supportive. I don’t think they can be fired as I was for announcing my choice on “60 Minutes”. That’s good.
Please share this site with others and have more people tell their stories. I’m also hoping more parents tell the truth about the disappointments they have faced with the reality doesn’t match the promise of parenting.
By the way, in the 70’s many women could not get their tubes tide if their doctors thought they were too young! You were lucky to find a doctor who valued your own needs.
Marcia Drut-Davis
My husband has his own computer business. That’s how.
Trust me…I don’t know anything about designing any blog. (LOL)
Thanks for the vote of confidence.Are you a person who has no regrets about not having raised children?
I cannot agree to using or doing anything that would inhibit a Woman from having a child, but I agree that having a child if the Mother does not want it is a bigger sin. An unwanted child is an unwanted piece of trash and if often hurt or will suffer the life on being unloved and constantly interfering with the good times of its mother. This is usually the result of the mother that was not properly cared for by her mother or father. God Bless those women who do not have children and grant that those that do want a child will have it.
Thanks for taking the time to post your response. Religious people have difficulty with the idea of choice. Indeed, many wedding ceremonies ask the couple to accept children lovingly into their hearts. Right? You don’t agree with people who who have children who are not wanted.Yet, if people can’t use protection, how can choice be viable? In my opinion, I don’t support people having children because they feel they should, or want to be accepted by their family, or want to save a marriage, or want to have someone to love them forever.
Big help, big help. And superlative news of cousre.
I have often thought of having a child, but I have also thought about the negative stigma of being a gay parent in today’s society. Not to say that being a gay parent is a problem, there are so many problems in our culture without adding this to the list. Really who can define what normal or healthy is. Every house is vastly different from one to another. I mean surely I have a great job and the resources to take care of a child, but for some reason to adopt I would have to wait three times as long as a heterosexual woman. I mean correct me if I am wrong but does anyone want to be considered what society today considers “normal”?
Thanks for this honest post, Michael. It’s a harsh reality that gay people would have to wait three times as long to adopt. I don’t think breasts potentially being able to produce milk and a vagina makes for a better “mother”. It would very interesting to know whether or not the same pronatal influences have the same effects on gay people. Are they a better couple if they decide to adopt or have a child born from a surrogacy birth? Are they looked upon with more acceptance if they are seen as a family of more than two?
Ask some of your gay friends. I’m sure that would be an interesting read for anyone reading this blog.
As for whether or not living a normal lifestyle is what people want….you yourself said that very word “normal” so subjective! What’s normal any more? Yet, it is normal, in my opinion, to want and have children by the majority of society’s all over the world .I wonder if I was on “60 Minutes” again is people would still threaten me?
Yeah that’s what I’m tklaing about baby–nice work!
I didn’t know where to find this info then kboaom it was here.
Any human not in the “normal” group faces challenges. So sad, isn’t it? Society has a definition for normal that doesn’t meet reality many times.It’s up to us to be open, honest and embrace our own lives with passion, self respect and acceptance. To not do that is remaining a victim of society’s ignorant branding.
I think so. Yeah. Everyone should be taxed because even if you don’t have kids, there is a societal good to having free education for all kids. The alternative would be to only have education for those who can afford it. We either all chip in for roads, fire departments and schools and libraries or we don’t. We all benefit from these things, even if we never use them. Just my two cents.
Thanks Jen. I agree. But do you think everyone should have the same amount of taxes? Should The Duggers pay the same as you who have
much less (or no) children? Your two cents are important. Thanks!
I cnnaot tell a lie, that really helped.
Just what the doctor ordered, thakinty you!
Thanks alot – your answer solved all my pbrolems after several days struggling
When I was child free I never balked at paying for the schools. Most districts levy a tax on housing to pay for it. So, only homeowners are taxed to pay for schools in many places. We supplement that with a sales tax. So really, lots of people with kids are paying no taxes towards schools at all and others are paying more. I don’t think it should be tied to number of kids or lack of kids at all. It’s a societal good that the children that exist in our society be provided with a quality education. If you want a good society then you should be willing to help pay for that. It has nothing to do with whether or not you have kids. I’ve never thought so anyway and I’ve always been happy to pay taxes to support schools. Even when I was childless.
Way to go on this essay, hleped a ton.
It’s important to get this information out to people, isn’t it? Thanks for the vote of confidence.
Going to put this aritlce to good use now.
Ho ho, who wodula thunk it, right?
Can you please tell me more details in this question? I get so many wonderful responses and just don’t know what you are asking. Please refresh me as to what this is about. Thanks.
Wow, this is in every respect what I neeedd to know.
Great thinking! That really bekars the mold!
I love to teach English as a second language. I see you may speak another language. I want to know what you write.
Can you explain, “Is ready to help?”
Thanks alot – your answer sovled all my problems after several days struggling
You are so awesome for helping me solve this msteyry.
This is a sore subject with me… I do NOT believe I should have to pay taxes for schools!! I did not choose to have children, so I don’t think it is necessary to pay, so every brat in the school can have his/her own laptop computer and whatever else they give kids now. I live in one of the countries highest school tax areas, and also one of the largest senior citizen communities in the country. I am not a senior but I do understand how the seniors feel. They are retired, living on a fixed income and they have to pay for other peoples kids to have a billion dollar education. If schools were more like when I went, they would not need so much money.. Somehow, people have gotten clouded judgement about children needing to have a decent education, and yet, I AM SMARTER than said children…I cannot believe how stupid children are these days. I listen to them talk and they sound like blithering idiots…sorry, but, NO I don’t want to pay for your retard to have an education, especially for all those “spectrum disorder” classes…when most parents should stop feeding their children MSG laden crap food and stay at home and cook a meal here and there for their kids so they don’t have ADD and ADHD…Perhaps we could spend less on school if parents actually parented their children and stopped letting an idiot box do it for them.. and now that I am getting off topic I will stop here.
You won’t win anyone with words such as “brats” and “retards”.They are terrible words that will never win you any arguments.
I agree that many kids labeled as ADHD could use better foods and nutritional support but there are no parenting classes to teach this before people have children.
I do feel we should pay taxes for education. That’s how our education was funded , wasn’t it? However, I don’t feel it’s fair if I have none and the person across the street has 5 and we pay the same taxes.
If ifnormaiton were soccer, this would be a goooooal!
Cheers pal. I do appreciate the wtirnig.
IMHO you’ve got the right asnewr!
Much informative and useful articles. I like it personally.
I was ralely confused, and this answered all my questions.
Excellent ideas, you just earned a new reader. I’m eager to know if you have any follow ups to this blog post?
Thank you. Unfortunately, there have not been many replies. people are still not open to my opinion that parenting should be taught before anyone chooses this difficult career. We must be tested to drive a car but not raise a human.
Unbelievable how well-wrttein and informative this was.
Very true! Makes a change to see soemnoe spell it out like that. 🙂
Alakazaam-information found, problem solved, thnkas!
I as a 45 y.o. male strongly feel that it should be a woman’s right to parenting. Whether it be maternal, adoption, invitro or step parenting it is her choice, the given right to her by the Universe.
Thanks Keith. Do you feel men have the same choice?
You made some decent points there. I looked on the internet for the issue and found most individuals will go along with with your website.
None can doubt the vearicty of this article.
I thank you humbly for sharing your wisodm JJWY
Sorry. I can’t read this. I can only read English. Try again. What language is it?
A million tahkns for posting this information.
It’s woendrful to have you on our side, haha!
I don’t understand what you mean. Can you tell me again?
Good job mkinag it appear easy.
That’s not even 10 mniuets well spent!
I wish I knew someone like you when I was growing up.
I knew from childhood that I didn’t want to be a parent. People in my family and even total strangers told me throughout my life that I was cold, defective, that I would be old and alone, that no man would ever want to be with someone who didn’t want children. A high school teacher, after conducting a class session in human development in which we were to write an essay describing how we felt about children and babies, called my mother at home to tell her I was “disturbed” since I had written “I don’t really care for babies. They’re kind of gross and noisy. If someone else wants to have them, that’s fine. It’s just not for me. I don’t even babysit.”
In women-centric offices, even though I was civil to parents, I heard whispers of “Oh, she’s the one who hates kids!” when it wasn’t even warranted. My favorite aunt told me that I “will never know true love.” This didn’t take place in the 50’s…this took place from my childhood in the 70’s all the way up to the 90s and I will sometimes catch a little grief these days, even though I’m beyond an age where child-bearing is considered safe and/or sane. Who knew?
Fortunately, I found my voice in my 30’s and raised hell in the media on behalf of the Childfree Network. I met Elinor Burkett (The Baby Boom author) in 2000 while taping a talk show pilot. I agitated on behalf of equal access to time-off benefits in the workplace, both in the public sphere and even at my own workplace. In person and online, I met many childfree sisters and continue to do so today.
I want to thank you for all of your work in paving the way for us. What you had to deal with in the wake of the 1974 broadcast made my heart hurt when I read about it. Thank you for the work you did then, and the work you are doing now on behalf of childfree people. I hope I can move through life with the grace and dignity that you have. I look forward to your memoir!
You know me now and I’m here for you, delighted to be connected on our life-path. I’ve spent 36 years years waiting to have the courage to write a book from the depths of my heart. All those people who wrongly categorized me, tarred and feathered me , warning of dire regrets are answered in my memoir, “Confessions of a Childless Woman”. Have there been regrets or self doubt? Of course! But when you read the memoir, you’ll see why! I believe you’ll enjoy the honest revelations. Thanks for these marvelous posts. Keep them coming!
Hi Marcia-
Just came across th is blog today; it’s wonderful.
The Duggars just scare me outright. “Pronatalist Nightmare” is an apt description. What scares me the most is how fascinated children are with the Duggars’ show. Instead of the show serving as a jumping-off point for discussion responsible family planning(including the right to NOT reproduce), many families I know of think it’s cute or entertaining.
The show is a postcard for irresponsible family planning, rigid gender roles, and lack of bodily autonomy(Michelle has put herself and unborn kids at risk by having so many, but leaves it up to her god). I was once laid up at home, sick with the flu. I watched a couple of episodes and witnessed the Trainwreck Effect; it was all so appalling that I couldn’t look away. That might explain why others like the show, I don’t know. I think the media embraces this family for the same reason. However, I notice they are getting less publicity in the wake of their youngest daughter’s birth; the little girl was born prematurely, and Michelle was in danger as well. Enough is enough, and I think the brainwashed public finally figured that out.
Welcome Elaine! I am smiling ear to ear this Sunday morning. I love your response. I love how you write and the wisdom in what you share. Maybe you and I can be on a panel discussion in the future? Or, a seminar when I bring my memoir to the public! How did you find me? Where do you live? (I live bear a beach too!)
By the way, did you see the opening previews on “The Duggers” where she’s asked if we will see another little Dugger this year? Her answer was that she would LOVE that! Cry with me.
As my younger classmates would say, “OMG What?!” The thumping you hear is my head hitting the wall just now.
The larger question should be can her body even safely carry another little Dugger? What is with these people?! Furthermore, does she not think about the needs of her existing kids? Life in that house has got to be like life in a group home. We all know how well that turns out.
Whatever you do, do NOT thump your head against the wall when you hear stories about The Duggers. It’s a waste of your sweet head.
Extremely helufpl article, please write more.
This site is like a classroom, ecxept I don’t hate it. lol
All of my questions settled. Thanks.
Good job mkanig it appear easy.
I caonnt tell a lie, that really helped.
Dag nabibt good stuff you whippersnappers!
There is a critical shortage of informative articles like this.
I think that if child-bearing and child rearing were instinctive, childless women would either be adopting in droves or kidnapping children. No doubt that we are designed to reproduce, but unlike other species, we have the ability to exercise reason over urges and impulses.
As a little kid in the 70’s, I received dual messages: toys and games designed for girls that almost always involved “mommy” role-play, and excellent TV shows such as Mary Tyler Moore, Maude, and the Bob Newhart Show, all shows that had either childfree female lead characters or as in the case of Maude a parenting lead character who got an abortion in the face of an unwanted pregnancy. I loved those shows because even if the storylines, etc. were above my head, they featured women with no kids, and that reassured me that I was not abnormal.
Girls and young women today are bombarded with “Bump Watch” layouts in celebrity magazines, pregnancy reports, gushing testimonials from celebrities about the wonders of parenthood, and not to mention that tired saw of “You can have it all!” Even mothers can’t catch a break, because they get flooded with “Supermom” messages from most media outlets and from their friends. There are few, if any, TV shows with childfree characters, and if there are, they are presented as shallow and materialistic. For those who lack a strong sense of self or those who deny their urge to NOT reproduce out of fear of marginalization, the drive to conform to these messages can indeed feel like instinct. It’s one of those “nature or nuture?” questions to be sure! =)
A friend of mine from several years back admitted to me that while she loved her kids, she would have rather have not had them. She only had them because both her parents and in-laws in her very traditional family intimated she was probably a Lesbian if she didn’t want kids, and that her husband would leave her if she didn’t “give him children.”
Where does instinct leave off and where does relentless, overbearing pressure come in? How many girls and women are going to ignore their true wishes and cave into these ugly pressures at the expense of the kids they didn’t want in the first place?
Love the comment about “adopting in droves or kidnapping”. You made me laugh and it feels good!
Glad I could make someone smile today!
All of my questions steetld-thanks!
My hat is off to your atstue command over this topic-bravo!
Hey, that post leaves me felenig foolish. Kudos to you!
Urgh. The requesite middle-school parenting class. I remember when my 7th grade class did this, and I wanted to opt out. “How dare this school assume I’m going to be a ‘mommy’ some day. How sexist!” was my line of thinking.
I think the schools need to de-emphasize parenting and concentrate more on explaining family composition, and that families of two are just fine. Inasmuch as I don’t see the schools as the primary agents for parenting education, the focus does need to be on making thoughtful, educated relationship decisions and not just parenting decisions. Educating youth about healthy relationships and sound decision-making goes so much farther than just parenting education.
As for the parenting assignment in my middle school class? The teacher listened to my argument, penalized me for being a non-participant and assigned me an essay instead.I hope kids today fare better.
Lenaring a ton from these neat articles.
Thought it woldun’t to give it a shot. I was right.
I…just….what?!
Oy!
*walks away*
I’ll be back when I can formulate an intelligent response. Be right back. Weeping for humanity.
Hats off to wheeovr wrote this up and posted it.
Well put, sir, well put. I’ll crteianly make note of that.
OK, I’m back. I think I can be coherent.
It’s stuff like this that makes me grateful for gender-neutral toys. As if the current marketing ploys aimed at little girls aren’t bad enough(“Girl’s World” aisles at Toys R Us, Easy-Bake ovens, “Princess” merchandising far beyond the Disney Princesses, et al) they are even more pigeon-holed into the Mommy role more than ever before. Wait. “Imprisoned” in the mommy role is a better choice of words.
I can just hear the breast v. bottle factions loading their weapons, but this isn’t about breast vs. bottle. It’s about relentless, pronatalist marketing. By it’s very design, the doll excludes boys who happen to like dolls, sending the implicit message that doll play isn’t appropriate for boys because males can’t nourish their young.
Pronatalist, sexist, and just plain wrong.
Thhougt it wouldn’t to give it a shot. I was right.
Good piotns all around. Truly appreciated.
The media misrepresented itself as a nonbiased entity and then virtually attacked this woman on camera wiping out her livelyhood and basically ending life as she knew it and did it all without even an appology or thought as to what they were doing. This reminds me of the Romans who sent others to fight for their lives for entertainment.
The media manipulates emotions and creates public issues that really are none of anyones business but the individual.
Having children is a choice, not a requirement.
Personally, I think that 60 Minutes owes Marcia Davis more than an appology.
You can ask 60 Minutes to re-interview me! Write to 60m@cbsnews.com
Thanks for this post.
The gneuis store called, they’re running out of you.
Marcia,
I wrote to 60 minutes, and I encourage others to do the same!
You are a dear sweet lady then in 1974, and now!
Keep up the fantastic work that you do for all of us child free by choice.
We love you Marcia!
AWWWWW I JUST saw this so I apologize if it took too long! We’ve had problems on this blog!!!!
Thanks Linda. Spread the word.
I never even met Mike Wallace who ended that 1974 telecast with, “Pardon our perverseness for showing this on Mother’s Day”.
Good point. I hadn’t thugoht about it quite that way. 🙂
Real brain power on dislpay. Thanks for that answer!
This does look prmoisnig. I’ll keep coming back for more.
Hi Marcia – I’m so glad to have come across your blog. I’ve been talking with a PhD candidate from Yale who’s doing research on NON/NAOP and it’s renewed my interest in all things childfree. My husband and I were active national NON/NAOP members. In fact, I was the last president of the organization when we closed the doors in 1982. At that time, due to funding cuts (Reagan administration), we felt we’d gotten the word out and hoped that other organizations would work to carry on the message about choosing to have children. ETR Associates in Scotts Valley, CA is still producing the “Am I Parent Material?” brochure developed in the late 70s.
I have a transcript of the “60 Minutes” program from 1974–so very sorry about how it affected your life. We were very active in St. Louis and the Bay Area and were often misquoted, and misrepresented, but never with such dire consequences.
We’ve just celebrated our 37th anniversary, and the 35th anniversaries of sterilizations–and not once have we regretted our decision.
Looking forward to your book.
WOW!!! So wonderful to hear from you. Our stories still need to be heard, don’t they? I believe most people thought I would be a saddened woman as I approached my 70th year on this planet.
NOT!
I also have a copy of that 60 Minute fiasco and would LOVE to have them revisit me. What did I know then?
My memoir is in the hands of an interested literary agency. Been there before so I just keep sending out the query letters.It’s been a long haul and worth it.
I was saddened to hear of Ellen Pecks untimely death from cancer in her early 50’s. She was the pioneer spirit who reached out to me at a time when the word “childfree” was unknown!
Thanks for posting and I look forward to hearing from you again.(Maybe next to me when we are interviewd on “60 Minutes”!)
Write to them and suggest they do that. 60m@cbsnews.com
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Perhaps………it’s because of PRONATILISM?
Thanks for the compliment.
This article acivehed exactly what I wanted it to achieve.
I’ve read back issues of the AARPmag, and the editorial slant of it is awfully middle-america/apple pie/vanilla ice cream to me. I think the upcoming generation of those who are of grandparenting age will hopefully be more educated, opinionated, and therefore more likely to discuss some of the realities of grandparenting. The magazine’s current readership is still comprised of those who didn’t have the option of childfreedom, so the magazine is going to preach to the choir…for now, anyway.
I would love to read honest reflections on some of those disappointments grandparents have felt, wouldn’t you? Some of my own personal friends and family have confided their extreme disappointments. Some have taken their grandchildren out of their wills!
Many people told me the biggest regret I would feel is the loss of grandchildren. Probably….if they were caring, warm, deliciously sweet and fun. (And is I could afford it.) There are never any guarantees as those assurances are never promised in raising children.
I have seen many people become uber grandparents where their entire lives revolve around their grandchilden sucking out any other possibility. I guess if that fits their needs, it’s OK. For me, I can’t stand hearing all those endless stories about little Lucy’s accomplishments or the photos of Little Lucy in dance class with the same silly look in every moment of frozen time.
Umm, are you raelly just giving this info out for nothing?
Hi from Denmark!I am a woman born in 1984 and I just got sterilized:-) alcautly I smile like a monkey on dope every time I get to show my scars of, but unfortunately it cannot be shown to every body. only five have seen them. So far.But I am glad I got it done, just not that happy about peoples reactions towards sterilization. My sister has three kids and is undergoing that same surgery I have had in a couple of days, and even though she has kids and runs a daycare, people still seem chocked when she tells about the operation. (She is 37 btw)But any who . Is there a good chance for me to view your apperance on 60 minutes?I would really like to see it and get my boney hands on your book now we are at it;-)Keep speaking up!They can’t ignore us if we just talk louder;-)Sincerly Anne Stenkje6r
Hi Anne! I remember you! You cant stop people from being ignorant. Nor, would I even try to convince people that my choice is right for me! Just keep on keeping on.
I have a copy of that 60 Minute program but I can’t share it. I am asking people to contact 60 minutes and request a revisit to that topic shown in 1974! The book can be purchased at amazon.com.
If you order it, let me know your reactions.
Wonderful seeing you in this blog!
Marcia
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In many cases you are never in a situation that you feel like you can be responsible enough to have kids. In that case, then yes, I am one of them that have a whole bunch of “furry kids”. And now I’m getting too old and still not stable enough to even think about bringing little humans into this world. The pets can take the place … But there is still an empty spot in my heart at times.
Fill that empty space in your heart by volunteering to be a Big Brother or become a mentor. There are so many kids out there who need your loving attention. Thanks for your sweet share.
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I did not want kids – don’t want to even hold other peoples ‘new babies’.
This doesn’t make me a bad person, but when a new mother says to me ‘don’t you want to hold the baby? at a social event or comes to visit. It is a tricky thing to tell this happy new mom, ‘no thank you’. Then, they want to teach you how to do it safely, … “no you don’t understand, I REALLY do not want to hold your baby or anyone’s baby. Please don’t take offense.
I don’t think babies are cute either.
I also hate people thinking how sad it is that I gave up having children for my career as a professional. Why? I graduated with a BS degree and a Master’s in Healthcare Administration, and was a board certified administrator when I retired. It was what I wanted to do. There is nothing ‘wrong’ with me because I didn’t want to be a mommie. Mothering is a full time job – 24/7. You can leave the office at the office, you can’t leave the children and I didn’t want to make that sacrifice for anyone. I lost two wonderful men over it.
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I am 65 years old and made the decision NOT to have children when I was 25. I was married but my husband and I made the decision together. Good thing; we divorced, I remarried a man who had one child and didn’t want more. WE divorced (he found a younger trade-in) and I vowed never to marry again. Never say never. I married for the third time, a man who had a daughter whom I’ve helped raise. Now she is a mother and I can enjoy HER daughter. I’ve never regretted my decision, I’ve had a lovely career, freedom to pursue adult interests, travel, take graduate courses and enjoy my relationship with my husband. Call me selfish, but I knew as a young adult that I was not prepared or mature enough to be a parent. My parents never bugged me about wanting to have grandchildren and left me to make my own decisions. For that I will be forever grateful.
I couldn’t agree with you more about Scary Mommy. I’m a child psychologist so it goes without saying that I have TONS of parenting books (and believe me, there are a lot out there). However, this is the one book that no mother should go without. It’s the only one that really tells the truth about motherhood. Check out my review if you’d like:
http://www.themommypsychologist.com/2012/04/04/confessions-of-a-scary-mommy-is-finally-available/
I breathed a sigh of relief to read your post. These blogs attract so many people just out to lure you to their site to sell something! You have given me hope that others can and will read this blog .I will check out the review and share your support of this book. My own book, “Confessions of a Childless Woman” is done. (Honestly, I had that title for three years!) It’s now three years trying to find that literary one agency willing to support the project. I won’t stop until I find them.
There’s another older book I can recommend called “The Mother Person by Barber and Skaggs.
Thanks for this post and supporting my efforts. PS: Have you seen this months AARP magazine about the rise in estranged adult parent/child relationships? Sure breaks the myth that says kids will love and respect you forever.
I think you’re right. We say that woman are free to make a decision not to have children, but in all actuality I’m pretty certain society doesn’t support this decision at all. I think we have a long way to go before our actions match our words.
Delicious to have a real post from a real woman who is helping others. I’m honored.
People always tell me it’s no big deal these days to honestly tell people there’s been a choice not to raise kids. The responses heard may be, “Sure! A lot of friends feel the same way.” Then, they walk away thinking,”Hedonistic, selfish bitch”. Advertising still sells products having nothing to do with children, with babies depicted as a normal way of family life.. (It’s usually an adorable baby and rarely a snarky teenager.) Even with more TV shows showing better reality, it’s with a lot of humor with all the challenges solved within the time constraints of that show.
One of the posts on your own wonderful blog was from a mom being pressured by her son to have a sibling. Even kids want to keep up with the norm!(I answered that post today.)
Thanks for being with me as I continue to swim against the stream. It’s good to have a buddy along the way.
Hi from Denmark!
I am a woman born in 1984 and I just got sterilized:-) actually I smile like a monkey on dope every time I get to show my scars of, but unfortunately it cannot be shown to every body. only five have seen them. So far.
But I am glad I got it done, just not that happy about peoples reactions towards sterilization. My sister has three kids and is undergoing that same surgery I have had in a couple of days, and even though she has kids and runs a daycare, people still seem chocked when she tells about the operation. (She is 37 btw)
But any who…. Is there a good chance for me to view your apperance on 60 minutes?
I would really like to see it and get my boney hands on your book now we are at it;-)
Keep speaking up!
They can’t ignore us if we just talk louder;-)
Sincerly Anne Stenkjær
Anne! How wonderful to hear from you. Denmark? One of my favorite people on this planet, who I call my “daughter-friend” is from Finland.
It’s refreshing to find a real person sharing real feelings with me.(There are so many spam artists who try and sell things via these blogs. )
When I just read your response, I smiled. I reached another person!
You’re choice to be sterilized made me remember many of my women friends in the 70’s who couldn’t get it done! Men had a better chance. Not women! At least that has changed.
The childfree lifestyle is rich and rewarding. There may be times of “regret” but that’s to be expected with so much emphasis on feeling the loss of never being a mother.
In my book, I talk about that in two chapters: Childfree vs. Childless and Menopause.
The book is currently being read by an agency showing interest. It’s the 5th time I’ve had an agency interested. I keep hearing, “it’s no big deal any more not to want kids”. People have no clue how this choice is still viewed with distain. As soon as I know it’s published, I will let you know.
I have one copy of the “60 Minutes” show. They make it difficult to share it threatening me with a hefty fine unless I pay them $300.00.
The last comment from Mike Wallace was, “Pardon our perversion for airing this on Mother’s Day”.
You made my day by writing to me. Thanks so much.
Marcia
Sorry for the intrusion, I am just testing to see if the site is working properly.
Thanks.
“women in their 20’s” does not just mean 20 and 21 year olds. I’m 29 and just had my first child. My boyfriend and I are not married. And I understand fully what it means to have a child and to raise her and to do right by her. I wasn’t lured by Hollywood. I have an ok job and I make decent money to support her. I made a choice. And I don’t need a piece of paper signed by the government to prove myself. I don’t owe an explanation to the world for my decisions. Articles like that do nothing but make me angry.
What is “normal” anyway? And whatever it is, I’m sorry that we can’t all fit into that nice little slot for you. Isn’t this whole blog about how you decided to go against the norm? Then why is it that when someone else does something that you find “weird” or “different” do you have an entire blog post about how it’s wrong?
Julie, thanks for responding. I will go back and read that article. I never want to make anyone angry. That’s not a happy feeling.
The most important thing is to make choices that are right for each of us. I wish you well and hope you continue to enjoy being a parent. I am always in awe of people who do that well while enjoying that career.
I absolutely agree with you that a piece of paper is nothing. Love, commitment and making choices while knowing their consequences is important. Right?
It’s been a while since I saw the article you cited so give me a chance to re-read it?
That article was in response to a NY Times Article in March. I didn’t write it. And, I can see why it would upset you. You made a few good points. Being 29 may be different from 20. Yet, it is in the span of years that NY Times article sited.
I’m curious as to why you checked out this blog. You made a good choice for yourself. Right? You are a happy parent, right? I think that’s terrific! Why did you check out this blog? I will tell you to be careful of people trying to convince you to have a second or third child. It’s pronatalism. Continue to make choices that make you happy. Again, thanks for your comment.
Self-published or not, let us know when it’s out!
Just self publish – screw the agents! I’m sure you would have enough interest judging by comments and feedback on this blog. You could produce an e-book that wouldn’t cost much. Your posts have been a great read for me today, and I think others like me (considering childfree/on the fence) would very much like to hear your experiences. I’m surprised no agents have picked up on this as a selling point! There must be millions of people my age (34), time ticking, having to decide what path to take. Keep us updated would love to hear more.
These questions are a big help for someone like me who’s on the fence…
“Am I parent material?” – I’m a step parent, have a great relationship with my step child so yes I know I can parent well.
“Do I have money, time etc?” – Money comes and goes, were ok. Plus I think once they come you manage (like my mom did). I do like my own time though..
“Am I having a child because I don’t want to be considered an “other”? Am I having a child to get attention? Am I having a child to get myself away from a boring job or schooling?”
– No. None of the above. I’m secure in my own choices and don’t mind what others think. I definitly don’t want a child for attention! (Do people really do that?!) My life, job, marriage is great – I’m far from bored! I’m very happy. I’m not looking to fill any ‘hole’, I don’t feel maternal around babies, I like children (but happy to give them back!), have zero interest in making a mini me or keeping the family name alive, don’t believe (or want!) a child to look after me in later years etc etc..
But.. even though I can list 100 reasons not to have a baby there’s still a worry that I may 1 day regret a childfree choice. I feel 99% sure I want a childfree life. I just wish I was 100% about such a big life decision.
I have been absent for a while, but now I remember why I used to love this blog. Thank you, IЎ¦ll try and check back more often. How frequently you update your site?
Hi Jeudy…..I am trying to see if you are real person. Please go to mdjd7@yahoo.com.
Dearheart! We are updating this blog and re-birthing its value.I am proud to say my memoir, “Confessions of a Childfree Woman” is now available as an Ebook on Amazon.comn. The printed version soon follows.(Back cover is now in labor.) I am so happy to be here for you and will continue to do my best to support the joys of the childfree lifestyle. I am also here to answer any and all questions.HUGS!
Marcia
I just finished reading your book and know that you ARE a pioneer and hero for discussing the choice to be childfree with the public. I am a 54 year old woman and have been married to my husband for 32 years. I never contemplated having children; I have always known it was not the right choice for me. I was brought up in a dysfunctional family; a belligerant drunk for a father and an enabling mother. Neither of my parents had the necessary skills to raise children. They were able to provide food, shelter, and clothing which is about it. My husband is from a dysfunctional family, too. His father was a reclusive alcoholic and would leave the family to go on drinking binges. His mother was mentally ill and eventually his parents divorced. Our childhoods were very chaotic. I have experienced all the society pressures about my choice to be childfree and felt quite alone in our pronatalist society. However, I am a firm believer that parenting needs to have standards. Many parents are unfit and society will not discuss that issue. I remember a few years ago my mom was at a senior center and during a class the instructor asked all the participants, “If I asked your children to name something that you did that impacted them negatively what would they say?” My mother was very agitated with the question and answered “We taught our children that what happens in this house, stays in this house. So they would have nothing to say.” Is that mind boggling or what! It would be a great pleasure to be able to shine a light on the fact that so many parents are unfit and cause livelong problems not only for their children but for society, too. Thank you so much for all you’ve done.
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Pattie, did I reply to you? Just checking to be sure I have.
I read the Mommyfriend article and didn’t find it tougne in cheek, but rude. I know unsolicited advice can be annoying, but tht comes from everyone not just the childfree. And you might be surprised just how many CF are tuned into parenting related places! As someone mentioned over there many of us are teachers and nannies and have some experience or at least an outside perspective. I know it can be tempting to offer it and to judge, but the condescension that you wouldn’t know the specialness of my child until -you- have given birth’ mitigates our choices. I have been learning about the kids in my people’s lives to understand them better, and all i ask is for the same consideration of my lifestyle. Life without kids can be just as hard, some of us are caring for sick parents, spouses or kids or have our own problems too. And it can be tough when the parents get preference for the holidays off, or special days to attend plays. I ask for the same consideration as a CF because I have family too (mothers, fathers, bros, and sis) and my pet gets sick occassionally. And someone has to not have kids to help balance the village. We are all people with our own choices. There are child places, please respect that there are adult places. And there are places for all ages and I am happy to see your kids there but please don’t expect me to be happy when they invade my space. I understand they are learning, but that is also why they are accompanied by adults. I liked this article. The author didn’t just blame the cf. And as a cf I can really empathize the pain of being rejected by a society for not following it’s strict standards. Parents get judged for not being perfect as we get judged for not having kids. We all have a beef with it, and we can change that together. And that thought brings me hope. (Sorry about the length, maybe I should’ve just blogged a reply somehow!)
Thanks for taking the time to share. All responses are valued.
I’ll be checking all of these out, Marcia — and add a piece I wrote too!
http://wp.me/p2CpPw-4K
Wonderful. Let me know what you think about the list. Isn’t it terrific to see so many things available? When I was younger, all I had was “The Baby Trap, by Ellen Peck. love being here for anyone seeking support.Being an “older” woman, I have lived this lifestyle for many years. If you have any questions, don’t hesitate to ask.
Marcia
Hi Marcia,
I have just finished reading your memoir and must tell you how much I loved it. I found it to be very well-written, and is in a style that gives the book a feeling that you are speaking personally to the reader.
I really appreciate your honesty and openness about living with the choice to remain childfree. It is still a difficult choice to live with for women today, as it is still largely unaccepted by wider society, and I truly believe that you have indeed been one of the ‘pioneers’ for other women in the same situation. I’m grateful for women like you who have had the courage to speak out about parenthood as a choice, you have definitely helped to create more acceptance for the childfree, and as hard as it still is to live with this choice today, I’m sure it was even more difficult for women of your generation.
As a 28 year old married woman who has made the decision not to have children, it is very important to me to hear about others who have chosen this life and have no regrets.
The possibility of being alone as I age is a very real fear for me, as is the risk of regretting my choice. It is very heartening and encouraging to come across other childfree women who are a little further down the road than me and are still happy with their lives.
Thank you so much for sharing your experiences with the world!
PS. I was pleasantly surprised to read at the end of your book that you and your husband have a chihuahua – my husband and I are also lucky enough to be owned by one of these wonderful little dogs, and his life (and our cat’s) is more than enough responsibility for us!
Kat, you have no idea what the words you shared mean to me. Taking time to tell your story and thank me is why I wrote this book. We, the childfree-by-choice, should be as proud of our choices as any parent. I urge you to live your life with joy and commitment to making it as good as you can. Reach out to the many children who are waiting for mentors or big sisters. (Some of them have been born into families where parenting was never considered a career!) Do this only if you enjoy kids! Or, help another organization you love. Be friends with many different people and ages. Plan for your future carefully regarding money. Let me know, from time to time, how I can help. Which chapter did you like the most and why did it help you? Don’t forget to share your reactions with others on social media.If you leave a review on Amazon.com, it will help more to read and gain the way you have.
Marcia
I have known about it since I was 12, even made a bet with my dad at 15 that I wouldn’t have kids before I reached 30. I got sterilized at 27 (I am from 1984) and I guess the bet is off because I cheated? It was a 1000 dollar bet, but hey! My parents gained more of my time to hang out with them because I don’t have kids to look after. (Now the question is if that is a good or a bad thing for them?)
You made me laugh! (I like that feeling.) I hope you used the money for a fun experience.
As for your parents having more time with you because you’re childfree, only they can answer.
If they have friends who chided them because they’re not grandparents, that may be another story.
Parents often feel cheated when they can’t get the icing on the cake of parenting which is supposed to be grandkids. Of course, there’s never any thought that a grandchild changes from that baby to a snarky teen. They can bring unhappiness through being non-responsive, or worse yet, choosing drugs or alcohol.
Thanks for taking the time to post!
Love it. Maximize freedoms of individuals!
“Freedom” is truly an awesome word meaning so much, right?
A very well-spoken, well-thought-out video. I couldn’t have said it better myself!
Thank you Audrey. I agree. We need more and more people sharing honest feelings about not wanting to have children. We need more people telling how they still are lead to feel “less than” for the important choice not to parent.
I just finished your book. It is one of the best ones I have read on leading a child free life. It finally helped me feel better about my choice.
Do you have any idea what your sweet words mean to me?
What chapter did you like the best and why? Thank you Amber. You just made my day!
Did you see the call for nominations for International Childfree Man and Woman of the year on my blog?
Hugs!
Marcia
Hi Marcia! Add Laura Scott, author of Two is Enough, to the list of authors donating their book to the winners! ~L
Oh yes, many of those reasons from the fact I’ve just never had that urge to wanting to spend my time doing what I want to do to the astronomical amount of money it costs to raise a child. I saw the moms in the park and as much as I’m glad they made the right choice for them and followed their own desire to have kids, I didn’t connect with that feeling. There are still many things in life left for me to experience for the first time that I don’t find a need to go back and re-experience things vicariously through a child.
I didn’t see Michael’s comment as directed toward the childless or childfree, but as a description of herself personally. For her, she felt she was immature and selfish before having children, and now she feels she’s not. I would tend to think that having her own fitness business and helping many people achieve their fitness goals is the opposite of selfish, but who knows what she has going on in her personal life. If having kids helped her with that, great. I don’t mind when people make that statement for themselves if that’s how they really feel. What I mind are the people who point fingers and say that we are selfish and/or immature simply because we don’t have kids.
I’m not opposed to helping out parents when I selectively choose to do so, but it shouldn’t be an obligation. I’m reminded of the Bill Maher quote “I’m tired of being constantly, involuntarily deputized into the fight to keep your kids away from adult pleasures. ‘It takes a village.’ That’s just a saying. Us other villagers are busy, okay? I have other things to do in the village.”
Maybe it’s true that parents in American don’t get as much assistance as in some other countries, but they do get benefits. In her article she says “Americans segregate our kids from larger society, not receiving much assistance from the community, more than pretty much everywhere else in the world.” I would have to disagree with the first part. Kids aren’t segregated from society. There are many places where kids get in free, restaurants where kids eat free, and so many businesses pride themselves on being “Family Friendly” which is fine BUT when a restaurant or lounge explicitly sets themselves up as being an Adult Only venue, parents get upset. I like kids, but there are times when I want to go somewhere that I know they’re not going to be, and the options for that are often limited.
Not having kids doesn’t mean you can’t go to to an amusement park (although I guess it does mean you can’t ride the kiddy rides, but if you’re into that you could always offer to take a friend or relative’s child with you). My husband and I went to Legoland Deutschland without kids in tow and we were definitely in the minority. But we also got to see what we wanted to see and do what we wanted to do and didn’t have to walk slowly and take a bunch of walking breaks or say “no” a thousand times when they want to buy everything in sight. There is nothing on that list I couldn’t do a version of without children if I were so inclined.
Again, I agree with you my childfree sister! Sometimes, I wonder if people who write these things are trying to convince themselves they made the right choice!(LOL)
Haha I have heard that “but women were put on this planet to have babies” argument before. Yes we are biologically designed to have that ability, but we’re also designed to be able to make our own choices. Just because I can do something with my body doesn’t mean I HAVE to do it. It’s an option, and not one I’ve elected to choose.
Here Here! Well said. Another thing to think about is how awful those woman feel who think they were placed on this planet to have a baby and are infertile or have husbands with a low sperm count. The amount of money and challenges they go through to be considered “normal” is terrible, in my opinion. Thanks for taking the time to share.
Great post! I laughed out loud a few times. Acne making you feel young, really? How young you feel is 100% based on your thoughts. If you have positive thoughts like “life is exciting”, “possibilities are endless”, or “I’m open to learning” then you will feel young. If you’re thinking is negative like “life is hard”, “people are bad”, or “I don’t feel good” then you will feel older regardless of how old the calendar says that you are.
I agree, Allison. I laughed as I wrote the counter-point too. Sometimes, you just sit back and have to laugh, right?
Have you read my memoir? If so, what did you enjoy the most? If not, go stand in the corner. (ONLY KIDDING!)
Cyber-space Hugs,
Marcia
Oh my! If I had a nickel for every time I have heard any of these……
You would be rich, huh?
I’m one of they guys and I’ve been given some of the flack listed in the video. I’ve gotten the reverse of you’ll make such a great mom. I got: “You’d make such a great dad” One thing that should be listed from the guys: “How can you deny a woman a chance to become a mom?”
Yes Andrew. Too many times the men are not included in understanding the pronatalistic pressures they receive. You would never be denying a woman a chance to become a mom if you let your wishes be known from the start.In my opinion, from the get-go, it should be known you prefer to live a childfree lifestyle. And, you can also make sure, if you’re not against it, that you would support being a mentor, joining Big Brothers/Sisters or being an active aunt or uncle if there are other children in either family. I would also suggest that woman read some of the awesome books on this topic! Too many feel it’s a biological need and have no clue about what parenting really is.You have to be true to your own needs and wants, right?
Yep…. I’ve heard all of these that are not female specific.
And the beat still goes on long after we’ve heard how choosing the childfree lifestyle is totally accepted. SURE IT IS.
Denver doesn’t have childfree dining yet. My husband and I are advocating for it on our website. I would think businesses would get the hint and create childfree hours or ban children outright under a certain age. They would do tons of business and make a lot of profit. They seem so scared of parents that they will not take this courageous step.
Hi Cynthia: (I must check out your website!) As for dining in peace, it’s amazing how defensive parents are to the word “Ban”. It’s as if we are taking a personal attack against their children. All we are looking for is a place we can enjoy our dining experiences without the challenges children may bring.I also wish for childfree zones on beaches and pools!
Hugs,
Marcia
Discovered your blog today and love it! Then I saw the title of your book, No Children, No Guilt and have to have it. I’m 44 and never had children (by chcioe). I can’t begin to tell you the schtick I get for this chcioe. Also, because I don’t look my age, people still say things like, When you have kids of your own .l Really?!Can’t wait to read this. Thank you!
Great. However the title of my book is “Confessions of a Childfree Woman”. Did you write to the correct author? (LOL)
I’m a single young adult, so I rarley get the question, Do you have kids? Most of the time, when I do, a simple, No, is enough to end that topic of conversation. I have been lucky to not receive so much stigma (yet). My mom still does not understand my decision, though!
Your Mom is under the same pronatal influence to announce a grandchild. If she’s the only one who can’t show photos and share sweet stories, she feels as if she failed. HOoor her feelings. Keep yours as sacred and follow your own heart.
When I was interviewed with my ex-husband on “60 Minutes” my mother in law said to him, “What did we do wrong to raise you this way?”
That was hilarious. I would have died if that were me. What an awful person but I know this is true and happens.
Never “die” for anyone’s stupidity. Right? Thanks for responding Rhona.
There are no childfree restaurants in my area but I know that some places in Toronto are considering it. I will visit and probably a lot if they do change to childfree. I love the concept.
We who are childfree…. agree with you. Keep asking at every restaurant you go to whether or not they will also have a childfree area or time when no children are allowed. (Of course, that will not happen in fast food restaurants!)Keep asking to be seated away from children, too. Thanks for responding.
Yes that could be me talking at work and in social situations. I’ve had every single one of these statements said to me. Why can’t people just accept the fact that I am happy without having children? Why is it such a foreign concept to them?
Maybe because it’s too late for them and misery loves company? I once had a friend say to me, “Damn it! I wish I had your lifestyle!”
Oh my lord. I made it only about 3-4 min. into the video. I couldn’t take it any longer. That is enough to make me want to stab my eyeball repeatedly with a fork. Thankful for Mirena and for my childfree life!
Thanks for the laugh!
3-4 minutes? I could only stand it for about 45 seconds… thankful for BC that’s for sure!
He scared my dogs…
SO SORRY!
He seems sick or something… or maybe he is just an annoying baby.
Some kids are just like that, a pain all the time. I hope it gets better soon for her.
OMG thank Jesus I don’t have kids…. This video was annoying. I do feel bad for the baby that he can’t talk and who knows what is wrong with him
A-men! I wish this video was heard by High School kids who never consider the real challenges of babies.
This was hilarious. I too have had all of these statements said to me throughout my life. I tell people now that ‘Being childfree is a decision made happily and responsibly. It isn’t an affliction. I loved the last question the cf woman was asked. “Do you like babies?” “I do but I can’t eat a whole one.” That line made me laugh most. 🙂
Hello Marcia.
As you know we have discussed the topic of this article in depth. As I told you before and as you know I have studied the Holocaust since age 12 (coincidentally the same age I decided I never wanted children). Many female Holocaust survivors chose to never have children because they didn’t want to see those events happen to their children. Others were physically unable to have children due to their daily struggle to survive the camps which were designed to slowly kill people if they weren’t selected for death immediately upon arrival. There were also women who were scarred by medical experiments, specifically sterilization, which rendered them incapable of ever bearing a child.
I think the Rabbi who spoke to you was a very wise man. You have had a huge impact on so many children. Now you help young women decide whether they want to take on the huge responsibility of parenthood or not. You have impacted so many lives in a positive way.
I am a Christian and most of the abuse I have endured for my choice to be child-free has come from other so-called Christians. I have never let it bother me because I made a decision I will never regret unlike most parents who are lied to about how wonderful parenthood will be. They then discover that is definitely not the case.
Of all the ministers I have had over the years the female minister at my church is the first one that accepts and understands my choice. She is my age and is neither married nor has children. I have lost count of the parishes I left because I was harassed for being child-free.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on your trip to Europe and Jewish guilt. I think every religion believes its members should have children, just because that is what you do. They don’t have a valid reason for why that is the case though.
Love all the videos! I am childfree and have experienced these exact situations so many times. Thanks for making the videos. Much appreciated and so true!
Jen…you know what? Me too! Even at almost 71, every video or supportive article is encouraging. Thanks for taking the time to share with me.
De Nada! It’s fun to be helping our childfree family.
Beautiful as the child (and as patient as you are, bless your heart) I think I would lose my mind. I’m contemplating having an expensive IVF procedure right now and you may have saved me thousands of dollars. But don’t worry – your baby will grow up and be fine. Maybe teething or something. Some days it’s just hard being a baby! And harder being that baby’s Mama. Take care.
Being a baby’s momma or father is a very, very demanding responsibility. Remember, the life and time of that baby is but a fraction of a human’s life. It’s not just the “baby”. It’s everything involving the care of that human. For myself, and many choosing the childfree lifestyle, life is fine without biological or adopted children. It’s very freeing to admit you may “lose your mind” hearing that primal screams of a child. I respect you for that honesty.
Good for all CFs.
Great post Marcia. Keep them coming
I’ll do my best! Thanks.
Thank you for this great blog post. You are the voice of reason in this crazy world.
“Reason” comes from experience. Thanks for that lovely compliment.
No, definitely not. One of the major reasons why we don’t have children is finance. We earn enough to be a little more than sufficient, but I know for sure we would become poor if we have children, unless we sell our home for a smaller place and stop saving for retirement, then we might be able to afford having children. But of course, these actions are unheard of and unwise. Basically, both of us have a stable job, but due to the current economic climate, salary increment simply has not caught up with inflation, so our net income has actually reduced. If we still insist on having children under these financial circumstances, then I believe our actions would be very irresponsible.
I love your honesty and rational thinking. Keep on keeping on enjoying the beauty of the childfree lifestyle.
Thanks for using my comment. Hopefully it will encourage more people, childfree or not, to give generously time or money! I’d like to start helping with serving the poor on Thanksgiving as well.
I love it when I can add words of wisdom from my beautiful followers.
Dear Marcia, thank You!!!
When I get any thank you or positive comment, I’m smiling!
I enjoyed reding your blog!
Music to my ears. Thanks Sandy!
Congratulations on winning this award Marcia and for the difference you are making to people’s lives. Reading your book taught me a a lot. For example, the concept of legacy is often attached to children, reading your book, however, reminded me of the fact that legacy is also about our contribution to society and by extension the world. I read your book with great interest and highly recommend it!
You have no idea how this makes me smile!
Marcia, may God bless you today, tomorrow and forever. I have never believed in taking anything for granted and always say thank you for everything and I mean everything. Thank you for sharing your experience and for being an inspiration for others.
I apologize for JUST seeing this post! Thank you from the bottom of my heart. Continue to help childfree people as you are doing.
I am a Childfree woman (and soon to be step-mother to a 23 year old). I am also Jewish. I constantly struggle to feel as though I belong at Temple, I’m the only woman my age (late 30s) without kids. I feel like I have “done my part” as I have been a pediatric oncology Nurse and a school teacher. Your Rabbi’s words resonated with me, It’s something those of us who have made the CHOICE to remain childfree need to be reminded of.
Thank you.
I hope this gets to you! I’ve been remiss in answering my blog!
To know I’ve reached another heart is a gift .
You HAVE done a lot as a pediatric oncology nurse! How lucky for those children and their parents.
Many thanks for sending me this response. HUGS!
PS: Do you know about our childfree group cruise this December? Email me at nokidcruise@gmail and I’ll send info!
Shannon….did I ever respond to you?
Treating myself to lunch. I call it my Childfree “Date Yo Self” Day.
LOVE IT!!!!!
I just read “Confessions” and thank you! My brother-in-law essentially black-listed me for not wanting to marry & raise kids because HE worked all his life at a job he didn’t like to fulfill his family obligations. I said I’d rather have a dozen abortions than wish that on myself or marry some loser (I had lousy taste). He, a good RC–who never goes to church–was so upset he didn’t even say goodbye as I left the house. I hadn’t seen my sister–or him–in 10 years as they live across the country. No wonder I moved. My lawyer said he & his wife practice “voluntary extinction”, too well-educated to bring kids into this polluted world. Thanks again, loved the book, made perfect sense to me.
Christel, I apologize for not getting back sooner. This site was severally hacked. It took months to get it back! We are born into families. We can choose to remain a victim of their ignorance or love those accepting us just the way we are. We are fine people. It’s simply a lifestyle choice. Thank you for sharing with me and buying the book! Now, share it with pride and feel free to write to me any time. We are having another CF group cruise in December! Interested? Go to NOKIDCRUISE@gmail.com and place your name of the list. Hope to meet you in person. HUGS! Marcia Drut-Davis
So sorry it took me this long to respond. My site was severely hacked!
Your words make me feel wonderful knowing I helped your life. Thanks for sharing.
The “loss” you mentioned isn’t. Wrap your heart around those who love you.
Would you consider coming with us on our next Childfree group cruise? Write to me at nokidcruise@gmail.com if interested.
Hugs!
Marcia
Hi Marcia,
As a CF woman, I’ve come across your story a few times on CF blogs and forums. I think you were brave to “come out” at a time when society was so hostile toward CF people. Thank you for sharing your story. I haven’t even told my family I’m CF but I guess I’m gonna have to soon, since I’m married and just turned 30 haha
Would you be interested in checking out a new childfree website? I’ve just launched a childfree dating/networking website earlier this week. 50 people have signed up so far.
I frequent a few childfree forums and I keep coming across these stories of childfree people dating and receiving judgmental messages from strangers on dating sites and being incessantly questioned by intrusive dates. There have even been many stories of long-term relationships falling apart because the non-CF partner has been waiting for the CF partner to change his/her mind the whole time. All these stories sound horrible.
I met my husband when we were in our early 20s and we decided to be CF together. I know I’d be going through the same thing if I didn’t luck out with my relationship.
So that’s how I decided to build a website just for CF people to find one another. Wanting or not wanting kids is a dealbreaker issue and there needs to be a place where CF people can date and get into relationships without the fear that their partner secretly wants kids.
I launched YesChildfree on reddit’s /r/childfree and I got some feedback that the CF people who already have partners would also like to be able to use it to find friends. It gets tough to find CF friends as you get older. So I expanded YesChildfree to allow for couples and people who are just looking for friends.
I know several childfree dating sites have closed down because there’s not enough members or funding. I’ve deliberately designed YesChildfree to be simple and economical. That way, I can keep it running for as long as it takes to build a large enough database for it to be self-supporting.
I mean, there are dating sites out there for horse lovers, clowns, cat lovers, bikers, gluten-free people, baby/diaper fetishists, hot sauce aficionados, sea captains, salad lovers, farmers, Star Trek fans, and people who think they’re vampires. I refuse to believe childfree people are more niche than them. 😉
When you have the time, please check out YesChildfree. If you like it, maybe consider joining us or adding it to your resources ebook.
Thank you! Hope you’ll like the site.
Best,
Dee
PS. You may want to fix the missing form on your Contact Me page. I first tried that page and was a bit stumped when I didn’t see a form, until I explored your site a little more. 🙂
Thanks for contacting me. I’m thrilled to see yet another source to help those choosing the CF lifestyle.Finding like-minded singles seems to be quite a challenge! I’ll surely go to your cite! I’m not that familiar with reddit!
Go to my group cruise email: nokidcruise@gmail.com. I’ll answer there.
The sad fact remains that society still is hostile to those choosing this lifestyle. Yes. More don’t face the criticism or shunning from family and friends. However, it’s still considered to be a selfish,irresponsible choice.
I’m hosting a CF group cruise next December, 2016. Perhaps we should talk about reaching singles together?
I’ll have my social media person check out that form you mentioned! Thanks for that heads up.
HOpe to speak soon.
Marcia
My husband and I organize a child-free MeetUp group … so of course we’ve scheduled a celebration event for Tuesday night!! Thanks for promoting this holiday that is worthy of celebrating!
Until I read this, I didn’t realize some people would not consider me childless by choice. I have married 2 men who had children, they were not mine. We attended family events and got along well, but that is nowhere near having children. I am a popular aunt, but chopse when I am involved in their lives. My choice. I choose childfree. Your life choices are your own. I hope to join one of your nokid cruises someday.
Denise, you just made my day! Of course stepparents can be childfree by choice! Instead of banding together and facing the wrath of too many, we are being divided by extremists. SOUND FAMILIAR?As for our gala cruise, I have a few cabins left for this next one December. I also just blocked cabins for next December, too.r to me at NOKIDCRUISE@gmail.com.
Sending hugs!
I just found this! Thanks so much for sharing. Of course it’s totally different with the label of Step-parents Vs Parent. There’s not one way I would consider them to be the same. I spent time with the step-daughters as a friend. They never accepted my friendship and were fed lies from their mother. It was a rude awakening how people may feel when they try to do the right thing, and fail! The worst art was when people from within the childfree lifestyle accused me of being a sham for once being labeled as a step-mother. SIGH! I”m now booking the next cruise! Go to NOKIDCRUISE@gmail.com and I’ll send you the info!
Having read this I believed it was rather enlightening.
I appreciate you finding the time and effort to put this information together.
I once again find myself personally spending way too much
time both reading and commenting. But so what, it was still worth it!
Our next cruise has dozens of supporters of the childfree lifestyle. We also have one mom, grandmom and friend who are parents supporting their heart connections to childfree people on board!
The guest speakers include: a young woman who chose sterilization at the age of 24, a man speaking from his heart, a life-coach and me! I’ll share the infamous “60 Minutes” fiasco that catapulted me into reaching you.
A world renowned Reiki Healer is joining us called to this group. (Only for those who feel they need her help!)
INFO: marciadavis@ketravel.com.
Feb 2-9, 2020
Norwegian Cruise Lines
Prices, right now, start at under 900.00 pp for an inside cabin.
FREE DRINKS?
FREE SPECIALTY DINING?
FREE AIRFARE?
FREE SHORE EXCURSIONS?
FREE ON-BOARD CREDIT?
It depends on cabin choices!
But even more important is being with like-minded people. It’s magical!
I’m 40 and I look 30, so I continue to get questioned for not having kids and that I will change my mind. How do I shut people up?
Just say, “Well….you may be right!” Notice…I’m NOT saying they ARE right! I’m giving permission for them to be right because they will never be wrong! Then, walk away and giggle because this is the best lifestyle on the planet!
There are more and more people making the choice to live a child free life. It’s amazing when we can find other CH individuals through social media and be able to offer support and a judgement free listening ear to each other.
This excellent website definitely has all the information and facts I needed abo
Thank you so much for being in part of the childfree movement.
Being childfree, I always get abused from social pressure. Family, friends, and partner don’t understand me and often try to change, put pressure and guilt me to be “the norm”.
I was often confused about who I am. I’m so grateful to find you and knowing that I’m not alone. Be able to accept that I’m just the “left-handed person in the right-handed society” and don’t feel guilty about being true to myself.
That’s how everything should be in this world. People being treated equally and respectfully regardless of race, gender, and everything else.